A Word of Caution Re: Hinek Collection Items

[Jake51]

Hi Everyone - Just wanted to clarify two points. (and I am the 'Tom' in the e-mail Pat posted, by the way.)

While what I stated in my e-mail was correct, Bernie and I talked about one of the Elway's in question prior to the auction and I hadn't been able to talk to him after these questions arose, I wanted to share that Bernie and I are now communicating with each other on this topic.

I also want to state for the record that I am not questioning Bernie's integrity. I am only looking for some clarification as to the history of the jersey I now own.

Thanks

Tom

[Good Eye Sports]

As per request from many forum members who know that I attended the Fleer Auction, here are 2 links to the full catalog.

There were not 1000's of GU items, much less football equipment. Most of the GU stuff were basketball.


PDF>> http://www.auctionsaleinfo.com/aucti...732_1-2051.pdf

Auction site> http://www.auctionsaleinfo.com/aucti...llcorporat.asp

Hope this helps someone.

[both-teams-played-hard]

There seems to be a lot of questions about Bernie Gernay's business practices. I was curious. I did a search of "Bernie Gernay" on gameusedforum.com archives. Is seems there are many collectors who have had positive experiences with Bernie! For example, this post from "Sal"...

August 22 2005 at 5:54 PM Sal* (Login baltimore_colt)

Response to Interesting observation......
------------------------------------------------------------------------
I actually met Bernie Gernay from PSI at the National in Chicago at American Memorabilia's booth. A real genuine good guy who says it the way it is. Maybe that's why I liked him! I will tell you that he may be the only one out there with REAL football gamers. I put my order in already for an unwashed Curtis Martin gamer. I hope it stinks like lemon juice, skunk, and vinegar!

-Sal

[kingjammy24]

Patrick, thanks for taking all of the time and effort to post all of this information on here. I know many, if not most, other people in your position wouldn't have bothered taking the time, effort, and hassle of posting on here solely for the benefit of others.

In a similar vein, anyone could ask me what business it is of mine to make most of the posts I make on here, given that I'm not involved the sale or purchase of the majority of jerseys I discuss. The answer, as sappy as it may sound, is I'm simply trying to do what I can to make a hobby I enjoy a better one by sharing information. Personally, I still don't think there's enough dissemination of information in this hobby. Compared to the amount of collective knowledge and experience out there, a relatively minute amount of it seems to trickle out. I don't think the Kim Stigall's, Howard Wolf's, Barry Meisel's and Rob Steinmetz's of the hobby post nearly enough to satiate me. Then there are others who have never posted on this Forum..Jim Yackel? the boys from Grey Flannel? John Taube? anyone from Steiner? (I understand the folks at MEARS are trying to get their own forum hopping and so posting here would just be counter-productive for the purposes they're trying to acheive.) Why not make the effort to share information? At any rate, before I go off on a tangent, thanks for taking the time to "share information", when many others would've chosen to do the opposite.

On a somewhat unrelated note, when should you start to question someone's integrity, as opposed to just questioning a particular jersey?
That is, how many bizarre, inexplainable acts does a person need to commit before people start to think that, even if a jersey seems ok, things might not add up?
I've always thought where there's smoke, there's fire. I've seen jerseys I thought looked good on their own but the actions of the seller seemed shady enough that I lost faith in the jersey. (I simply figured that there are issues that I'm simply not seeing because an ethical dealer selling a legit piece wouldn't be acting in such a way).

I'm sure there are fake jerseys out there good enough to fool me and many others, and in those situations the behavior of the seller may be all that's left to help us discern things.

Rudy.

[kingjammy24]

Good-Eye: I don't get it. I searched the auction catalogue with the "PDF search" and it didn't find an Elway jersey. Maybe the search function didn't work? If it did and if that's the entire Fleer auction catalogue, shouldn't the Elway jersey(s) be in there?

Rudy.

[suave1477]

Was there a Darryl Strawberry Jersey in the fleer auction?

[Good Eye Sports]

Good-Eye: I don't get it. I searched the auction catalogue with the "PDF search" and it didn't find an Elway jersey. Maybe the search function didn't work? If it did and if that's the entire Fleer auction catalogue, shouldn't the Elway jersey(s) be in there?

Rudy.

Rudy,

GOOD QUESTION!

[EndzoneSports]

Again, to clarify a couple of points that have now been brought up....

It was never the intent of the original posting in this thread to discredit Bernie personally or call his business practices in general into question. What was stated were the facts of one specific incident for which I was seeking clarification. I had provided Bernie, via e-mail, ample opportunity to provide clarification in this matter in a public and proactive manner. When he chose to not respond, I posted the facts of this issue on this forum, though not to discredit, but hopefully to elicit response. Unfortunately, while Bernie did respond, he did so in a rather defensive manner, never really getting to the issues at hand, which remain still. Nonetheless, I can say that, aside from this singular incident, in my very limited communications with Bernie I have also found him to be knowledgeable and straight-forward.

I am in no way trying to (nor am I suggesting that others should) imply that this is a "where there's smoke there's fire" type of issue. I have my own underlying speculations that I've derived from this set of facts and others may very well develop their own as well. I also strongly feel, however, that any such speculation should remain tucked away in one's own imagination and not bandied in public as if it were pseudo-fact.

In closing, I also wanted to take this opportunity to publicly thank Tom Jacobsen for coming forward, after having been unceremoniously "outed" in Bernie's posting. In respect for my colleagues' privacy, I made it an intentional point in my original posting not to list the names of the other individuals involved, a courtesy that Bernie apparently did not seem to be willing to extend to his customers. As such, once the cat was out of the bag so to speak, the posting of Tom's e-mail this morning did serve two purposes in that it validated that my original posting was not the complete pack of lies that is was made out to be, but more importantly, Bernie did finally make a phone call to Tom after this was posted on the forum. To this I offer a sincere, "Thank You Bernie!" along with a challenge that if you have still not done the same with Steve and David, that you make all haste in doing so.

Regards,

[Bernie J. Gernay]

I think this will be my last post on this forum. There are a few reasons for this decision.

Although there are many good points about this forum, there are many negatives. People are into it to bring others down. People make statements about others that are 100% false. So many people comment on things that they are 100% clueless about. I may not have knowledge in every single football style tagging worn by each team in the history of the game but I'm not going to sit here and comment on a game used Johnny Bench mitt either.

The poor guy (or maybe not so poor now) was ready to dump 30K in vintage game used football jerseys for a few hundred dollars because everyone on the forum told him they were all fake. How bizarre is that?

It is no coincidence why all the insiders, authenticators and big names in the industry don't post on this forum. And the ones that used to, are no longer here. They all say the same exact thing. It's usually the same person(s) posts who have sent this place into a downward spiral with the negativity. I know for a fact that this was not what the initial intention of this forum was for.

I have to come on a forum and explain to Pat Scoggin along with others where my Elway jerseys were sold to. Not whether they are real but how many were there. Fact is they are real and that is the ultimate fact of the matter. It is nobody business what card company we sell to or have sold to in the past. Then he's giving up to the minute posts as to who I called back, who I didn't and who I'm in contact with this week regarding the jersey. You can't make this stuff up. The sad thing is that there are only about 5 or 6 of the same people who post. That just makes it more insane if you actually think about it. For the record I called Pat 2 times yesterday and 3 times today leaving a message. However, I will somehow be accused of "never calling him" soon enough.

I refer to rule # 7 of the forum rules:

No Trolling or Baiting. You will not post any topic that disrupts the peace and harmony of this forum. Please do not create meaningless threads with the sole purpose of starting a dispute.

I will no longer have to publish my business dealing on a forum which will be nice. It will be much more peaceful in day to day business without having to deal with "bottomfeeders" along with the continual and blatant ignorance of the forums own rules.

[both-teams-played-hard]

I find it very interesting that my response to Bernie's thread was deleted moments after it was submitted. Why? Would one of the moderators answer my question on this post. PLEASE do not send me a private e-mail!