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  1. #1
    Senior Member Eric's Avatar
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    ebay seller lambeauleeper and "game issued"

    Fellow forum member mvandor mentioned in another thread that he had a "LT throwback game issue from 2005."

    I asked where he got it from and he said ebay seller lambeauleeper. I have noticed that lambeauleeper often sells high profile game issued items. He currently is selling

    Dan Marino 1990 "GAME ISSUED USED WORN" helmet
    with this description

    A GAME ISSUE or USED helmet is much harder to obtain than a GAME ISSUE or USED jersey. A Dan Marino (16+ years old) helmet is IMPOSSIBLE to obtain! This helmet was issued to Dan Marino for on-field GAME USE during the 1990 season. Since I have no documentation stating Dan Marino actually wore this helmet I am selling it as "GAME ISSUED". Exclusive features found on this Dan Marino GAME HELMET include Riddell WD-1 custom large helmet, proper mil. (thickness) decaling, single aqua/orange center stripping, NFL shield decal, DOLPHINS 25th silver Anniversary decal, clear warning decal, proper front red Riddell, 1990 facemask clips, Dan Marino's vintage custom aqua Schutt facemask, correct Riddell 4-point chinstrap, etc. VERY RARE offering from this HALL-OF-FAME Quarterback!!!

    http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=140115233762

    He also is selling and has sold

    Reggie White 1996 S.B. "GAME ISSUED USED WORN" helmet

    Brett Favre 1996 S.B. "GAME ISSUED USED WORN" helmet

    Tom Brady 2003 "GAME ISSUED USED" Jersey

    Brett Favre 2002 "GAME ISSUED USED" Auto'd Jersey

    I wrote the seller today and asked him

    "Do you get all of your "issued" pieces from the teams? Or are they replicas made to the exact specs to the real ones that you are selling as issued?
    I know people who are interested in your Favre and Marino helmet and were wondering the same thing
    Eric"

    He wrote:

    "Through trades and purchases. I am not sure of the history of these pieces."

    Then I wrote:

    "So how can you call them team issued of you don't know? Did the Tomlinson throwback helmet you sold come from the Chargers?
    Thanks
    Eric"

    He wrote:

    I don't know

    I then wrote:
    So, you're selling these pieces as "game issued" and you have no idea if
    they came from the teams, right?

    He wrote:

    They have the EXACT specs and dates of GAME WORN items from that player. I have seen items no where near the authenticity of these items soldon EBAY.

    -------------------------------------------------------------------

    Seems like the seller might be exaggerating his claims here. "Game Issued" suggests it was made by the team for the purpose of play. From talking to the seller, it sounds more like he's taking liberties.

    Many times if collectors cannot afford a game used item, the next best thing, and a more affordable option is to buy an issued item which is game ready. It's really the next step down to have something that might be from the team, and might be manufactured by someone with a shell and a bunch of decals.

    Buyers should be careful when seeing this kind of terminology in listings. It doesn't necessarily mean what you think it means. Sellers should accurately describe what they're selling.

    I'd be interested in people's thoughts
    Eric
    Always looking for game used San Diego Chargers items...

  2. #2
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    Re: ebay seller lambeauleeper and "game issued"

    Eric its disgusting he is an adult and knows right from wrong. POINT BLANK NO EXCUSES

    He is selling high premium items as items that were made for these players to be worn or used in an actual game, meanwhile it could have been my cousin Jimmy who ade it in his garage.

    But because he didnt know my cousin Jimmy made it he automatically thinks it gives him the right to call it Game Issued.

    How about the fact all the people who probably spent big money on those others players helmets you mentioned and they have no clue that the Helmet could of came from Toys R Us for free with purchasing a slurpee.

  3. #3
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    Re: ebay seller lambeauleeper and "game issued"

    Gentlemen, IMHO you're overreacting to this general issue, and specifically to this seller's listings.

    Let me start by saying it would be nice if things in this world were as they should be. However, as we all know we live in a very flawed world, sadly twisted by greed. Game used collectors should know this better than anyone because the larger dollar values have invited off the charts fraud. This forum does a great job of documenting this.

    Let me say on the general issue of use of the term "game issue" that within 6 months of becoming an NFL memorabilia collector, I had learned that the term is VERY liberally used. My naive assumption in the beginning was that it meant "team issued" and came from the locker room. Over time I learned that it almost always was used to refer to a stock item that had been customized to approximate what the team issues to the players.

    I have had discussions with major reputable ebay sellers on this issue from Rick Radtke to the owner of Gridiron Authentics. If asked pointedly they will give you honest answers. I've even asked Rick to stop using the term, but in a competitive market I understand why he has not. Recently, Gridiron Authentics has been selling off a series of Tom Brady "game issue" helmets and I was told that they came from the company supplying the Patriots helmets to the team, and that all customization was done by that company identical to those they delivered to the Pats for Brady's use. Well, that's close, but not quite the same as coming from the team.

    Lambeauleeper hasn't done anything the rest of the sellers on ebay haven't done. He doesn't say his items came from the team. He doesn't sell volumes. He drops 4 or 5 helmets on the market a few times a year, right now he only has one feedback you can view because the rest are too old, for example. Further, most of his helmets don't sell for huge amounts, so the profit motive is nothing like in the "game used" market.

    I've followed his stuff for about a year, having bought a Tomlinson throwback game issue helmet from him that I believe has a good likelihood from my research of being authentic - or at least the best copy I've seen of the dozen or so to hit ebay in the last year. At $400, I can live with it either way.

    I generally feel that the term "game issue" is too liberally used, yes, but he does not try and lie as to provenance of his items.

  4. #4
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    Re: ebay seller lambeauleeper and "game issued"

    Quote Originally Posted by mvandor View Post
    Gentlemen, IMHO you're overreacting to this general issue, and specifically to this seller's listings.

    Let me start by saying it would be nice if things in this world were as they should be. However, as we all know we live in a very flawed world, sadly twisted by greed. Game used collectors should know this better than anyone because the larger dollar values have invited off the charts fraud. This forum does a great job of documenting this.

    Let me say on the general issue of use of the term "game issue" that within 6 months of becoming an NFL memorabilia collector, I had learned that the term is VERY liberally used. My naive assumption in the beginning was that it meant "team issued" and came from the locker room. Over time I learned that it almost always was used to refer to a stock item that had been customized to approximate what the team issues to the players.

    I have had discussions with major reputable ebay sellers on this issue from Rick Radtke to the owner of Gridiron Authentics. If asked pointedly they will give you honest answers. I've even asked Rick to stop using the term, but in a competitive market I understand why he has not. Recently, Gridiron Authentics has been selling off a series of Tom Brady "game issue" helmets and I was told that they came from the company supplying the Patriots helmets to the team, and that all customization was done by that company identical to those they delivered to the Pats for Brady's use. Well, that's close, but not quite the same as coming from the team.

    Lambeauleeper hasn't done anything the rest of the sellers on ebay haven't done. He doesn't say his items came from the team. He doesn't sell volumes. He drops 4 or 5 helmets on the market a few times a year, right now he only has one feedback you can view because the rest are too old, for example. Further, most of his helmets don't sell for huge amounts, so the profit motive is nothing like in the "game used" market.

    I've followed his stuff for about a year, having bought a Tomlinson throwback game issue helmet from him that I believe has a good likelihood from my research of being authentic - or at least the best copy I've seen of the dozen or so to hit ebay in the last year. At $400, I can live with it either way.

    I generally feel that the term "game issue" is too liberally used, yes, but he does not try and lie as to provenance of his items.

    Im sorry to say this but I disagree with almost everything you said here.

    Overreacting I don't see that possible as he is still trying to sell a retail item as Game Issued. You can hide behind saying "well Game Issued can mean many things to different people"
    But in plain enlish Game Issued means exactly what it means GAME ISSUED the item was made specifically for GAME PLAY
    If the item was made to the exact specifications of a player but not made for the team / player to use for a Game, then it is called (Pro Cut for Jerseys or Pro Made for other items)
    Now your saying well he only drops a few of these a year into the hobby, hellooooooooooo that is a big deal because that means these so called items that he claims to not know where they come from will end up in the hobby one day as Game Used.
    You say well its $400 and worth it since it looks pretty good.
    Well to the average collector / buyer likes to actually spend $400 for the item he is told hes buying. Not turning around insinuating its the real thing and your actually just buying a good look-a-like.
    Also you make spending $400 as is an easy loss to take well not many people just have $400 to throw down the drain and say "oh well its just $400"

    I dont mind you taking a defense on his behalf but it bothers me that you tried to make good points out of what the flaws are in this hobby and the reason why a forum like this is needed.

    Eric I will tip my hat off to you again for creating such a forum so we can try to elliminate that bad out of it as much as we can. Whether it be a small percentage or a lot but at least we can try to curb some of it.

  5. #5
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    Re: ebay seller lambeauleeper and "game issued"

    I'll speak for the Brady items this individual has sold....First, the helmets are WRONG because of the small size.....Brady wears a larger size. Second, if you're going to sell a game issued 2003 Brady jersey, make sure its at least a game issued jersey. The jersey lambeauleeper sold recently on Ebay (see attached pictures) was a store bought, not even sure if it was a "real" authentic jersey, which had a neck tag and tail tag added.....100% bogus jersey
    Attached Images Attached Images    

  6. #6
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    Re: ebay seller lambeauleeper and "game issued"

    I don't know this seller who is selling these items, but in general, if you're selling something, especially sports memorabillia wise, I think you have a responsibility to know where your items come from and if they are game used, game issued, whatever. You should make every attempt to make this known in your description when selling an item!!!!!

    Aaron

  7. #7
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    Re: ebay seller lambeauleeper and "game issued"

    mvandor,

    Thanks for clarifying the use of the term "game issued" as that is not a term I have run across as a football jersey collector and seller (I don't collect helmets). In my opinion, the term is confusing and misleading, especially since they are describing an item that was not issued by the team for possible game use. Shouldn't the sellers be using the term "replica" or "authentic replica"? You can't get much clearer than that, and that's precisely what it is - a REPLICA!!!

    But I guess this is no different than folks listing a jersey on ebay and in the header calling it "game worn", then backpedaling in the description with innuendo, disclaimers, and other bits of information and misinfomation that further clouds the issue. Again, why not call it what it is - a REPLICA!!!

    Mark Hayne
    Gridiron Exchange

  8. #8

    Re: ebay seller lambeauleeper and "game issued"

    Eric:

    Please contact me privately via e-mail at EndzoneSports@msn.com. I've lost your e-mail address and may have an offer for you that you can't refuse.

    Best regards,
    Patrick W. Scoggin
    Endzone Sports Charities
    www.EndzoneSportsCharities.org

  9. #9
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    Re: ebay seller lambeauleeper and "game issued"

    Suave, have you reviewed his currently for sale and sold items? You seem to be rather quick to call him a crook and judge all his items "retail".

    In the few weeks I've been hanging around here I've photo checked alot of supposedly game used jerseys and easily was able to disqualify a ton of them by a simple photo check. However, I've been unable to disqualify this ebay seller's helmets so easily, for example his Reggie White matches every available photo on gettyone.com for the SB in question, as does the Favre. The Marino I discount as I've spoken to individuals at HelmetHut (if I recall correctly) who know the equipment manager for the Dolphins during the Marino years and has opined that virtually none of Dan's helmets got out of the team's control. Nevertheless, from the exterior, it looks very good (I do note he doesn't show pics of helmet interiors which might be giveaways as to authenticity if shown, don't know).

    It seems to me if someone is gonna be a memorabilia crook, they'd go for the big money, wack on the helmets, and auction em as game used - AND push some volume. It seems odd someone would auction so few helmets, refer to them only as "game issue" and not lie as to proof of provenance if it was an ongoing scam.

    Do I know his helmets are legit from teams? Nope. But he doesn't represent them as such, only that they match the game helmets as far as specs, and that he commits the sadly common sin of using the "game issue" term.

    My principal focus in collecting over the last year has been helmets, and I can nearly always spot flaws in supposed "game issues", yet this guy's stuff I can't. So either he's got some legit helmets or he's better at his effort than volume helmet copiers like RealStuff.

    Can't comment on his jersey(s), not my area of expertise.

    I guess my point is it's easy to take cynicism to an extreme given the degree of fraud in the hobby. However, for the most part this guy's use of the term "game issue" is no worse than anyone else selling these types of helmets on ebay.

  10. #10
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    Re: ebay seller lambeauleeper and "game issued"

    BTW, beantown, you refer to a Brady helmet he sold, but I see no such item either in his feedback or completed listings. Where are you getting that one from?

 

 

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