McGwire, Sosa, Palmeiro, and Steroids

[richpick]

We as Americans have had a history of absolutely killing a persons character in the media when they are accused of wongdoing. We see it everyday across the spectrum and in every facet of industries and jobs. On the flipside, we as Amaericans also have a tremendous willingness to forgive and forget when enough time has passed. There are many examples of Americans who have done wrong and then many years later are saluted as heros. My statement is that when enough time has passed 10, 15, 20 years it seems logical that McGwire, Sosa, and Palmeiro will be welcomed back into the baseball family and heralded once again for their accomplishments. Take Pete Rose for example he in many peoples opinion broke the worst rule in baseball and at the time he did it most people wanted him out of baseball forever. Now all these years later most baseball fans would not be against having him in the Hall of Fame and returning to baseball is some form and he for almost this entire time denied ever commiting any wrongdoing. What I am predicting is that the above mentioned men will down the road be in the Hall of Fame and beloved by a lot more fans then they are today.

[suave1477]

Richpick I disagree with you on this in ways as you might be right some where years later down the road those mentioned may or may not be forgiven. Your comparing them to Pete Rose which is comparing apples and oranges. Pete Rose gambled on baseball and threw games in a matter of speaking he didnt do his wrong doing by using artificial enhancements to make himself better to break a record.
McGwire, Sosa, Palmeiro, Bonds all went passed one of the most beloved held records in baseball, the single season home run record which was fought to officially be given to Maris without the asterik and just a few years after be broken by someone who took drugs or enhancement groth hormones to break.

I don't seem them being forgiven for a long long long time.

I know I will never, in my eyes Maris will always hold the record until someone does it with there own god given capabilities.

[JasonM33]

Here's a few of my random thoughts on steroids in baseball.

1. It's a level playing field because most professional athletes are using them to some degree.

2. Bodybuilders have been using steroid since the at least the 60's so it's foolish to think that we know exactly who was taking what and when in baseball.

3. Just as many NFL players use steroids if not more. However, the peception is that football is clean and baseball isn't. I don't know if it's because of the differences in their testing policies or what. Baseball football, boxing, the Olympics, they're all dirty.

4. Drug testing is always going to be a step behind the drug takers. Masking agents are constantly evolving to give the juicers the advantge.

5. The problem is too widespread. Because you cant really prove who was juicing and who wasn't it's not fair to start giving some of them asterisks. You'd have to wipe out a whole generation of records and mistakes are bound to be made. It's too late. So, it's up to the individual to decide how they feel about it.

[CansecoPower33]

For me, the difficult thing with this is that I find myself in agreement with both sides. While lauding the game for the way it was - long before I was ever born - I still miss the excitement of baseball in the 1980s and 90s. Whether the downturn in the prodigious home run or the 98mph fastball is related to the new testing program is not entirely clear, but I think baseball's witch hunt for the larger, power player is hurting the game. Players nowadays, as all too often happens in society, are pressured to fit a mould. The game isn't as brash or bold as it was once, and I don't think it's for the better.

I don't want to focus on individual cases, but one that really stands out is Jeff Bagwell. There appears to be some split on whether or not he's a hall of famer. Why Bagwell? What is it about Jeff Bagwell, a player who has never tested positive nor been linked by a single shred of evidence to any banned substance, that allows his hall of fame credentials to be called into question? Is it because he was a power hitter in the 1990s, because he played at just over 200lbs in his prime, or because his bum shoulder was obviously the ill result of steroid abuse? If the steroid scandals show one thing, it's the inadequacy or the Hall of Fame voting system, where sportswriters are given the role of judge and jury in deciding player's fates. The same sportswriters, who gleefully covered these same players when times were good, turned reactionaries after the BALCO investigation upturned the truths about a select number of players.

If these writers were at all worth their salt they'd have smelled a rat years ago, or at least said something openly. This is what you get when you allow the ill-informed to run the show.

[JasonM33]

I don't have anything against sportswriters in general. However, I agree that giving them such influence in who goes to the Hall of Fame is a huge mistake. These guys make their living pestering and critizing players. Some players are bound to give the writers a hard time. With that said, I'm sure there are some personal vendettas affecting Hall of Fame votes from time to time. There are defintely some players that are given a free pass while others are frequent targets. I also think that the writers were complicit in the steroid era because they looked the other way. Now they are all acting like jilted lovers when the truth about steroids comes out. If the sportswriters say they didn't know players were juicing, then they are either ignorant or they are being disingenuous. Either way it leaves me questioning their competence to make any important judgements on professional athletes.

That's just my two cents worth.

[metsbats]

Richpick I disagree with you on this in ways as you might be right some where years later down the road those mentioned may or may not be forgiven. Your comparing them to Pete Rose which is comparing apples and oranges. Pete Rose gambled on baseball and threw games in a matter of speaking he didnt do his wrong doing by using artificial enhancements to make himself better to break a record.
McGwire, Sosa, Palmeiro, Bonds all went passed one of the most beloved held records in baseball, the single season home run record which was fought to officially be given to Maris without the asterik and just a few years after be broken by someone who took drugs or enhancement groth hormones to break.

I don't seem them being forgiven for a long long long time.

I know I will never, in my eyes Maris will always hold the record until someone does it with there own god given capabilities.

Suave,

Just to clarify, Palmeiro did not break Maris' 61 like the others. He was just the 3rd player in history to have 500 hrs and 3,000 hits.

David

[pietraynor]

Further clarification, believe Palmeiro was the 4th to reach 500HR/3000 Hits behind Aaron, Mays, Murray. Jay

[metsbats]

Further clarification, believe Palmeiro was the 4th to reach 500HR/3000 Hits behind Aaron, Mays, Murray. Jay

Thanks Pie! I stand corrected. Forgot about Steady Eddie!

[suave1477]

Thanks guys I know palmeiro didnt break the single season record I was just thowing his name in the ring because he was mentioned and he is part of the roid user group thats all.

[whatupyos]

Palmero was caught and served time for steriod use, but its unfair to say he's part of the user group when McGwire, Bonds and Sosa have never been convicted of using!!! One can make guesses as to who used but its messed up to convict without proof!!! Just because someone got big doesn't mean they were using, you can get big naturally! Canseco isn't the best source in the world. Whatever happened to innocent until proven guilty??? Guess some people do it guilty until proven innocent which is a shame. To me, I can care less who uses and who doesn't. If steriods were such a big issue you'd have everybody breaking records which didn't happen. Plus it wasn't illegal in baseball. What about other sports...dope is smoked in sports but no one jumps all over people for getting high or snorting coke. Can't they be performance enhancers too? Lets take it back to the old school...what about stimulants when back in the day a bowl full of "greenies" would be sitting on the table in the clubhouse for all to pop? Maybe Pete Rose messed up, maybe Palmero messed up...they still belong in the HALL OF FAME!!! Point blank, period...It's not like they hurt people physically, never abused anyone. It's a shame some people want to judge and point fingers. Sure, clean up the mess, but forgive and move on. What's done is done. Life is too short!!