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kingjammy24
07-16-2007, 01:22 PM
Hall of Famers Bench, Carter differ on Bonds HR chase
By SCOTT SONNER, Associated Press Writer
July 16, 2007

STATELINE, Nev. (AP) -- A pair of Hall of Fame catchers who hit their share of home runs have different takes on Barry Bonds' pursuit of Hank Aaron's all-time record. Johnny Bench and Gary Carter said Bonds' chase for 755 is good for baseball, but they part ways when it comes to the role steroids may have played in his success.
Barry's going to break the record, and it's phenomenal," said Bench, who hit 389 home runs in his career with the Cincinnati Reds to rank 48th on the career list.
"To think he can walk over 200 times a year and do the things he does. And he was a Gold Glove outfielder. He didn't do that by taking (steroids). He was just a great athlete," he said.
Carter, an 11-time All-Star who hit 324 homers, said Bonds has had "a great career," but questions if he could have gotten so big without performance-enhancing drugs.
"I saw him when he first broke in. He was a scrawny, skinny, 185-pound guy that had great talent. And then he turned himself into a freakin' power hitter with, what, 245, 250 pounds, and his head got twice the size. So, you know, you figure it out," he said.
"I know he likes to go to the gym. We all like to go to the gym. You just don't get that big," he said.
Bench, who played in the same group with Carter this weekend at the American Century Celebrity Golf Tournament at Lake Tahoe, doesn't understand why Bonds is being singled out when there are so many players who have been accused of taking steroids.
"They still haven't found him guilty of anything," Bench said.
"Have there been guys who are probably guilty? Probably so. And your wife has probably had a face lift or (breast implants) or a tummy tuck. We're all trying to do performance enhancement every day. Tiger Woods got lasik surgery. Is that performance enhancing?"
"If I could take HGH, I would in a heartbeat because I want to live longer," said Bench, who turns 60 in December and has a 15-month-old son. "I want to be as good as I can possibly be."
Bench admits that steroids give a player an advantage on the field.
"Of course it's an advantage. And the bats are an advantage and they moved the ballpark fences in. These guys are strong. And hell, I hit 45 home runs that one year and I felt like I could have hit 60, but now the guys are so much stronger," he said.
Bench, who played in 14 All-Star games, said it's difficult to compare today's players to those of the past because so many things have changed.
"We're second-class citizens now, our era. Our records are bygone," he said. "They're making $15 million or $20 million a year. I made $11,000 my first year. I was rookie of the year and made $20,000, was MVP and made $40,000, was MVP again and made $80,000. So I'm only like $19,920,000 behind. "There are guys out there who make two All-Star games and they've got their own planes flying back East. I'm trying to drive to Reno to get the 6:45 a.m. Delta so I can change planes and go to Orlando," he said.
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rudy.

33bird
07-17-2007, 01:59 PM
Good Stuff. Thanks for sharing it Rudy. What would be Bench be doing and making today? Like Dimaggio said to his owner, "Hi ya Partner."
BENCH BEST CATCHER EVER

camarokids
07-17-2007, 02:23 PM
I watch both Carter and Bench growing up as a kid . Both were great players . What a great time in Sports History and life .

I think you can't say one player was the best ever in all of baseball, but rather say someone was best in his era . I think was the best catcher in his era, damn good hitter .

So much has changed not just in sports but our lives as well . I don't know if all the changes are for the better . But I do like the internet .

33bird
07-17-2007, 03:03 PM
Well, in Bench's case, I'll say hands down best ever. 10 gold gloves, 2 mvps, great hitter, 2 rings, etc. Most the historians agree on this one. Piazza could hit good but played in the cookie cutter era and was a crappy catcher; Irod great catcher but can't match Bench with the bat. Just my 2 cents. That's what's great about baseball-being able to debate the best evers.
Greg

camarokids
07-17-2007, 03:18 PM
I was just thinking about Yogi Berra would be a good choice 4 best ever during his era .

Johnny Bench was damn good , definitely the best in his era ....

33bird
07-17-2007, 03:32 PM
I think Yogi is the 2nd best ever to Bench. A close call for sure.

suave1477
07-17-2007, 03:33 PM
33Bird I agree to disagree as I agree Bench is definitely the best for now but I disagree with you as I believe Irod is easily going to supass Bench with his eyes closed.

You said he is not the Batter Bench was thats arguable, even though Bench hit more home runs then Pudge.

BOTH OVER 17 SEASONS
Pudge career average .304 - runs 1194 - hits 2445

Bench career average .267 - runs 1091 - hits 2048


just about every category Pudge is better except for Home Runs and falls a little short on RBIS

But you can't really say Bench is a better batter AND REMEMBER THIS IS THE MID OF 2007 I am sure Pudge is gonna add a few more to those numbers

suave1477
07-17-2007, 03:36 PM
And while your at it you might as well throw Posadas name in to the ring becuz his numbers arent that far away from Pudge and he is in his 13th season which means he still has another 4 more seasons to go to match Pudge

33bird
07-17-2007, 04:10 PM
Well, lets not discount just how important HRS and RBIS are-and Bench has Irod beat in both categories. You can have your batting average and singles. Bench has the higher OBP (just barely), which is a better indicator of success than batting average. He also has well over 100 more HRS, and 200 rbis than Irod. Plus, he spent a 1/3 of his career hitting during the best pitchers era in baseball history and then most of his career hitting in the 70's which can't be compared to IROD hitting his whole career during the hitters greatest era and in hitters parks in Texas and Detroit and the steroid era -which his name has come up numerous times. Irod is good but no Bench.
Greg

33bird
07-17-2007, 04:17 PM
More proof. Irod's #'s will probably get worse as his career is winding down and he's no longer on the juice. I'm talking his career ba, obp, and slugging pcts.
Sabr has Irod's most comparable players as:
Joe Torre, Jeff Kent, Ryne Sandberg, and Ken Boyer. Only Ryno is in the HOF and Kent probably will get in.
Bench most comparable players:
Yogi Berra, Gary Carter, Carlton Fisk, and Jeff kent. 3 solid HOF's and 1 eventually HOF.
Do the math.
Greg

suave1477
07-17-2007, 04:28 PM
33bird ok i cant argue with you there, and yes I know how important HR'S and rbi's are, but I am just saying Pudge does have a lot more categories then Bench which in comparison numbers wise brings them to be pretty close as batters.

But in comparing Bench to those others hall of famers was was the most comparing thing they had in the 300's hr runs

Well no matter what we say are argue about here chances are Pudge is a sure hall of famer. And I will even go out on a limb and say possibly Posada lol lol:p

33bird
07-17-2007, 05:41 PM
Yea, he probably is. Posado too, unfortunately, since I'm a Spankee hater, but I really believe if Bench was playing today in these cookie cutter parks, hitting juiced balls, andusing the juice he'd end up with 600 HRs and 1600 RBIs. You put Irod and Dumbo back in the 60s and 70s then I'm thinking they're more like Ted Simmons and Darryl Porter and that class of hitting catchers. No doubt though, that Irod is a solid glove.
Bench Fan

suave1477
07-17-2007, 11:54 PM
Hey no need for name calling you leave my favorite catchers ears alone lol lol they help for aerodynamics lol lol:p

suave1477
07-18-2007, 10:29 AM
33Bird I find it interesting that you would throw Ted Simmons name in to the ring as a lower comparison. Because his numbers are right a long side of Bench and even better in some cases, the only thing that stands out overall for Bench is the HR's
Sabr compares Ted to every Hall of Fame catcher but Bench, funny how Ted wasnt called to the Hall.

JimCaravello
07-18-2007, 10:36 AM
Why not votes for Thurman Munson?? I'd take him any day - over any catcher that has ever played the game - throw the numbers out the window..........

33bird
07-18-2007, 01:31 PM
Simmons could hit, but without Bench's power and not in his class as a catcher. If you want a hard working catcher that hits singles and has no power then Thurman is your man. I remember the 76 World Series when Thurman got a hit everytime up but they were always singles. I remember Bench hitting HRs about every time up, tying a WS record with Rbis, and nobody running on him including mickey the quick rivers because it was a lost cause.
JBench