Eli and Giants Fake Memorabilia lawsuit

[metsbats]

http://nypost.com/2014/01/30/eli-and-giants-created-fake-memorabilia-suit/


If this is true one has to wonder how many other teams may be doing this.

[akrover]

Heard about this on the radio. Seems pretty bad. Especially using the laundromat to fabricate wear.

[marino13]

This is going be REALLY bad .. for everyone involves.


There will be a lot more lawsuits coming -- I would if I was Steinersports and everyone who ever purchased anything Giants/Eli related.


This is just bad on Eli's part!

[cliffjmp33]

I read this earlier and glad it got posted. The one thing I'm curious to see is how Steiner is portrayed as the case goes on. They weren't named in the lawsuit, but the excerpt below makes one pause.

"Some of Manning’s alleged fakes were sold through famed memorabilia house Steiner Sports, with whom he had an exclusive deal.

Steiner, believing its items to be authentic, sold them “to unwitting customers and sent them via the mail,” the suit says.


Angry buyers started to complain after noticing that markings on their items didn’t match those that appeared in pictures of Manning’s game-day duds.


But Manning told Steiner they were legit, and Steiner resold returned helmets to other buyers, the suit claims."


I have had good experience dealing with Steiner, and doubt they'll comment on this as it's an impending case. Something for us all to keep an eye on I think.

[BULBUS]

As a Giants collector, this is upsetting :( Glad I never broke the bank on Eli stuff

[gorilla777]

Wow, brutal....

[mbenga28]

What about jerseys sold by JO Sports? Talk about pot calling a kettle black when Giants terminated their contract with JO after Jarrod got into trouble selling fake game used.

[allstarsplus]

This is why the NFL needs a system like MLB Authenticated. We all saw what happened with JO with football jerseys and the mess with Brett Favre and it is time the NFL takes care of this with a real authentication system both at halftime and after the game.

The issue with 2 jerseys worn each game has been an issue for a long time. Collectors deserve better than this.

[allstarsplus]

What about jerseys sold by JO Sports? Talk about pot calling a kettle black when Giants terminated their contract with JO after Jarrod got into trouble selling fake game used.

As I was typing..........

Agreed.

[ironmanfan]

I wonder what members here have any of this stuff? Anyone want to share what Giants gear that have obtained through Steiner?

[yankees506]

Wow, this stuff isn't cheap I'd be livid. Disgusting if true

[mbenga28]

When something like this happens, and if true, how much liability should be placed on the memorabilia company selling to collectors? Like with Steiner, should they be considered innocent because they took Eli's word that the items were game used, or do they have a responsibility to photo match the items before selling them to the public? It's worrying to also hear that when buyers returned some items to Steiner saying the items couldn't be photomatched, that they did not investigate further and instead just sold it again to someone else.

[ivo610]

A lot of Eli items at auction right now.

[Phil316]

Wow......speechless. This should put into question any and all Giants game worn/used equipment unless a photomatch can be had.

[Dewey2007]

Even Meigray Giants items?


Wow......speechless. This should put into question any and all Giants game worn/used equipment unless a photomatch can be had.

[ivo610]

Even Meigray Giants items?

Of course. If the EM had a hand in it I would question all of it.

For the record Meigray is one of the good guys in the hobby IMO

[BarryMeisel]

Hi Dewey2007 (and everybody),

MeiGray last acquired jerseys directly from the Giants following the 2002 NFL season.

We have sold and authenticated NY Giants through the secondary market since then. But our authentication procedures for those secondary market jerseys all have included photo-matching and have come with our 100% lifetime guarantee of authentication and protection.

Hope this clarifies,

Barry

[ironmanfan]

the whole thing is just another black eye on the hobby unfortunately

IMF

[KGoldin]

Wow......speechless. This should put into question any and all Giants game worn/used equipment unless a photomatch can be had.

Based on the news today, we have added photo matches to the 2 ELI manning game worn jerseys in our current auction.
'better safe than sorry'.
I would advise people that this is a civil action, and anyone can accuse anyone of something civilly. Before we tar and feather Eli and the Giants, we should let it play out. Although I know that that is hard to do....

http://www.goldinauctions.com/Eli-Manning-Game-Worn-and-Photomatched-Signed-Home-LOT8542.aspx

http://www.goldinauctions.com/2007-Eli-Manning-Game-Worn-and-Photomatched-Signed-LOT8381.aspx

[Roady]

If this is true it is disgusting but should not be a surprise.
Even those who seem to have everything want more.

[dplettn]

It's been my impression on a few occasions (ie: misleading autograph inscriptions pertaining to use) that Steiner has lower standards than they could/should. I still remember applauding the Chicago Cubs for bringing their GU program internal. I haven't known anything about the NY Giants or Eli Manning's memorabilia practices but it definitely brings up some issues. I have game used bats and ticket stubs that are PSA/DNA authenticated and some jerseys that were PSA/DNA authenticated for NFL Auctions. Can the sticker really be as relevant to a football jersey as a baseball bat? In my opinion, no. One has the most rigorous scientific standard of certainty possible. What's the sticker really mean for an NFL Auctions item though?

I'm not fully confident merely because something came from an NFL team... what if that team or league doesn't have respect for our hobby? Or, rigorously high standards for itself? I believe I've seen enough reason to be doubtful of the Arizona Cardinals and New York Giants. Anyway, teams' standards is exactly the problem this legal case seems to isolate for our hobby. In the case of NFL items up for auction I'd like to know which ones are photo-matched as a supplement to provenance, and which are not. My standards of confidence in the items differ from one to the other.


____________

I collect game used Bengals and Reds items. Please contact me at plettner at fuse dot net if you may have something special or not represented in my collection. For very modern Bengals stuff I may also be as knowledgeable as anyone outside the locker room if you need an opinion. For older Bengals items or Reds items (any era) there are many folks whom are far more knowledgeable than I.

[GMEN92]

I wonder what members here have any of this stuff? Anyone want to share what Giants gear that have obtained through Steiner?

I have an eli helmet that I acquired from a friend after he had some thoughts about it because wasn't finding any match..
As I continued to search and search I was shocked to find out I could NOT find one match at all..
And now this hits the news and BINGO.. I guess I have one of the Faked helmets that's in question...

[GMEN92]

eli helmet

[GMEN92]

Back side

[GMEN92]

Front side

[GMEN92]

Steiner coas

[GMEN92]

I will also say that I do know the person that owns and has the real game used Super Bowl 42 helmet as well as about 25 more helmets from that Super Bowl. , and I will say that I have seen the helmet in person and actually photo matched it as well and it is indeed without any doubt the actual helmet eli wore in the game ..

So I will strongly agree with the facts released that the eli helmet in the hall of fame is definitely not the helmet he wore in the game.
Again there is no question about it. ....

Now I wonder what my next step will or should be as after reading all this and being sick to my stomach over the amount of money spent and having some faith in the Steiner COA and thinking I would find a match for my eli helmet .. And now NOTHING...:mad:

[GMEN92]

Hall of fame eli vs the eli he owns to the actual game photos.. .

Sorry for large pics I don't know how to make smaller.. But maybe the fact there bigger will help YOUS see the matches ..


And I am one that strongly can care less about a paper COA. Or loa.. I mostly go by photo matching because 95% of the time there's no lying or doubt with a perfect match.. ..
This all is just unbelievable and they need to figure out who put theses fakes on the market.. And as a die hard giants fan.. I can't believe this would happen .

[GMEN92]

Hall of fame vs. Game used

[Enyouartist]

When something like this happens, and if true, how much liability should be placed on the memorabilia company selling to collectors? Like with Steiner, should they be considered innocent because they took Eli's word that the items were game used, or do they have a responsibility to photo match the items before selling them to the public? It's worrying to also hear that when buyers returned some items to Steiner saying the items couldn't be photomatched, that they did not investigate further and instead just sold it again to someone else.

Plausible deniability.

[GMEN92]

I will also add to this that the 2001 michael Strahan game used jersey (sack record season )that's in kens auction is mine and it is 10000% legit and I have several photo matches available for it as well. It has PSA/DNA COA.. And MEARS A10 PERFECT SCORE COA
.
I am only adding this to this thread as I want any possible buyers to know they have nothing to worry about and can bid with not worrying about any issues
Regarding its authenticity ..
If you want more pics of it I can provide them if needed. Just ask.

[BU54CB]

This is why the NFL needs a system like MLB Authenticated. We all saw what happened with JO with football jerseys and the mess with Brett Favre and it is time the NFL takes care of this with a real authentication system both at halftime and after the game.

The issue with 2 jerseys worn each game has been an issue for a long time. Collectors deserve better than this.

The NFL doesn't care about the collector, its pretty evident with their current NFL auctions. They provide limited photos, poor descriptions which are sometimes inaccurate. Some of their items aren't what they say they are and the holograms and psa cert #'s don't always match.

I think it would be even worse if they had more to deal with, each team should handle their own jerseys, equipment, etc. IMO

[allstarsplus]

The NFL doesn't care about the collector, its pretty evident with their current NFL auctions. They provide limited photos, poor descriptions which are sometimes inaccurate. Some of their items aren't what they say they are and the holograms and psa cert #'s don't always match.

I think it would be even worse if they had more to deal with, each team should handle their own jerseys, equipment, etc. IMO

They should care about the collector.

You still need an independent authenticator hologramming as the players take off their equipment. MLB has it right and the system above the authenticators is good. The system isn't perfect but its better than any other sport. I can say all this as part of the game used system with our store in the Orioles stadium. I've been so frustrated when we request a jersey and the authentication comes back as Game Issued and the authenticator says "Sorry, didn't see the athlete take the jersey off". Well, after reading this story I can now appreciate the extra caution.

I still hope they go a step further and barcode but I realize how labor intensive that could be.

Again, no system is completely perfect. A 100% conclusive photomatch is our way to perfect what we have.

[stonedylan]

I am surprised at all the negative comments. The Giants are a class organization and personally I would be shocked if the allegations were true!

[helmet lover]

I hope that any teams or players thinking of something like this will think twice about it,because as many of you I love this hobby.I could never afford a star players gear & happy with GU 2nd string helmets or jerseys.I would HAVE to have a definitely have to have a photo match for a star player

[helmet lover]

I hope that any teams or players thinking of something like this will think twice about it,because as many of you I love this hobby.I could never afford a star players gear & happy with GU 2nd string helmets or jerseys.I would HAVE to have a definitely have to have a photo match for a star player

I hate to hear that about fellow :confused member GMEN92:confused:

[helmet lover]

I hate to hear that about fellow :confused member GMEN92:confused:

that stupid face came out in the wrong space,it was supposed to be at the end of the sentence.Hate to hear that about GMEN92

[Jules9]

Here's another article, updated story from May 2013:

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/i-team/justice-dept-drops-fraud-charges-sports-memorabilia-dealer-article-1.1345254

[stonedylan]

What ever happened to innocent until proven guilty!

[Roady]

What ever happened to innocent until proven guilty!

Most of the post I see as being very careful not to say anyone is guilty. What are you talking about?

[Eric]

More info on the lawsuit.

Eli Manning says he and NY Giants will fight lawsuit claiming they sold 'fake' sports collectibles

The suit claims that Giants employees created and sold dozens of fake items 'for personal gain.' The New Jersey memorabilia dealer -- Eric Inselberg -- who filed the lawsuit has a dubious past within the sports collectibles industry.

BY MICHAEL O'KEEFFE / NEW YORK DAILY NEWS

PUBLISHED: THURSDAY, JANUARY 30, 2014, 8:39 AM
UPDATED: THURSDAY, JANUARY 30, 2014, 11:28 PM


The NY Giants say a lawsuit claiming that the team, as well as quarterback Eli Manning, sold fake memorabilia is 'without merit.'
Eli Manning and the New York Giants will wage a battle against what they called a meritless lawsuit filed Wednesday in New Jersey that claims that the quarterback and his team sold bogus “game-worn” jerseys, helmets and other bogus collectibles to unsuspecting customers.

“The Giants told me this suit is completely without merit and I have no reason to believe otherwise,” Manning said Thursday as his brother Peyton prepared to play in Sunday's Super Bowl. “The Giants are going to fight it and so will I.”

The New Jersey memorabilia dealer who filed the suit, in fact, has a dubious past — even by the dog-eat-dog standards of the sports collectibles industry. Eric Inselberg, who filed the complaint in Bergen County Superior Court, was linked in 2007 to a fake Michael Jordan warmup jacket scam that helped spark an exhaustive Chicago FBI investigation into fraud and corruption in the sports memorabilia industry that continues to this day.

Earlier this week, Chicago-based agents were among the federal law enforcement officers who raided and searched the Arkansas home and office of memorabilia dealer John Rogers, who owns one of the world’s largest photo archives, according to a source familiar with the investigation.

“The suit is completely without any merit whatsoever and we will defend it vigorously,” the Giants said in a statement. “We will not otherwise comment on pending litigation.”

Former NFL quarterback Archie Manning — the father of Eli and Peyton Manning — said the family was blind-sided by Inselberg’s allegations.

“It’s a bombshell, and it’s a bombshell to him, too,” Manning said Thursday of his son’s reaction. “Eli’s always tried to do what’s right. It’s Super Bowl week, and you’ve got to create a story out there but I don’t know anything about it.”

A Hall of Fame display featuring Eli Manning's game-worn helmet from Super Bowl XLII is actually a fake, according to a lawsuit filed by Eric Inselberg.
He later said the family would “get through that.”

The Chicago FBI investigation that included Inselberg also led Bill Mastro, the former owner of Mastro Auctions and once the most influential executive in sports memorabilia, to plead guilty to fraud in October and acknowledge that he had trimmed the world’s most valuable baseball card, a T206 Honus Wagner card once owned by NHL great Wayne Gretzky that sold for $2.8 million in 2007. He awaits sentencing in U.S. District Court in Chicago.

Inselberg was one of six memorabilia dealers accused of selling counterfeit game-used jerseys to trading card companies and other buyers in 2011. The other dealers pleaded guilty, but Inselberg chose to fight the charges.

The Justice Department dropped its case against Inselberg in May of 2013 after his lawyers claimed Giants employees and other witnesses had lied to federal agents and the Illinois grand jury that indicted Inselberg. The lawsuit, the court papers say, is an attempt to make the Giants accountable for the false statements that led to Inselberg’s indictment.

“When the government came knocking on the Giants’ door, the response was a cover-up that threw Inselberg under the bus,” the lawsuit claims.

The suit claims that Giants employees created and sold dozens of fake items “for personal gain and out of cold indifference to the importance fans and memorabilia collectors place on authentic pieces of sports history.”

The lawsuit by Eric Inselberg is filed a day before the NFL holds a press conference during Super Bowl week to detail efforts to stop the flow of counterfeit merchandise and tickets.
The suit alleges those items include a helmet on display at the Pro Football Hall of Fame that Manning purportedly wore during the team’s Super Bowl upset of the New England Patriots six years ago.

Manning, according to the suit, participated in the scheme because he wanted to keep items he wore in significant NFL contests. The fraud was well-known among Giants players and equipment managers, the lawsuit added.

New York attorney and sports memorabilia collector Jeff Lichtman told the Daily News that while he does not know if the allegations leveled against Manning are true, Inselberg’s suit is yet more evidence that collectors need to do their homework. Obtaining items directly from athletes or their reps doesn’t mean they are authentic.

“It should tell you something about the hobby that even when you get an item from players, it may not be the real deal,” Lichtman said. “You wouldn’t spend $100,000 on a car without checking it out. Why spend that kind of money on memorabilia without checking it out?”

NFL officials, meanwhile, remained tight-lipped about the allegations that Manning and Giants employees were involved in the sale of bogus memorabilia. Instead, they focused on warning consumers about criminals attempting to sell counterfeit NFL gear. “ The only thing I know about it is what I read this morning. There were allegations that were made. There hasn’t been any findings. There might not be,” Anastasia Danes, NFL vice president for legal affairs, told a press conference Thursday morning. “I don’t have a response. I don’t know anything about it other than what I read in the complaint in the story.”

John Sandweg, the acting director of U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement, said the Internet has made it easier for counterfeiters to sell fraudulent items to sports fans. “Historically you would see it where it would go in the flea markets, and game vendors, but what we’ve seen is the criminal organizations are eliminating the middle man, creating sophisticated websites, and then selling it directly to the consumer,” Sandweg said. “It increases their profit margin. It also makes it more challenging for us.”

Inselberg may have dodged prosecution, but collectors and dealers remain suspicious of his role in the Jordan jersey scandal. Despite the scrutiny it led to of Mastro Auctions’ practices from the feds, the company’s officials sold the Jordan North Carolina warmup shirt at an Aug. 3, 2007, auction even though an authentication company had told the company it was an obvious fake.

Memorabilia Evaluation and Research Services concluded that while the item was indeed a North Carolina shooting shirt from the 1980s, it did not belong to Jordan. When placed over a light table, MEARS wrote, it was apparent that another name had been removed from the back and replaced with “Jordan.” The letters also seemed to made from materials different than that of other patches on the piece.

“The Michael Jordan shirt we evaluated did not start its life as a Michael Jordan shirt,” authenticator Troy Kinunen concluded.

A collector named Jim Reed told The News that stains on the apparel looked remarkably similar to a warmup shirt he had purchased from Ranzino Smith, who joined the Tar Heels in 1985, the year Jordan was drafted by the Chicago Bulls.

Reed said he sold the jersey to Inselberg in 2006. Inselberg told The News that he sold the shirt at a Westchester memorabilia show in January of 2007, but he didn’t know the buyer’s name and could not contact the man because he had paid cash.

Mastro Auctions sold the jersey for $11,000, but ultimately voided the sale. By then, however, the FBI investigation was in full swing. Mastro and two other auction house officials, Doug Allen and Mark Theotikos, were indicted on fraud charges in 2012. Allen and Theotikos have entered not guilty pleas and are awaiting trial.

Mastro Auctions was dissolved in 2009, and Allen and Theotikos later went on to form Legendary Auctions. Rogers, the Arkansas dealer, is an investor in the company. A spokesman for the United States Attorney in Chicago acknowledged that searches were conducted at Rogers’ office and home on Tuesday but said he could not comment further.

- With Christian Red



Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/giants/giants-lawsuit-manning-team-fake-memorabilia-merit-article-1.1596396#ixzz2rwoKEMkG

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/giants/giants-lawsuit-manning-team-fake-memorabilia-merit-article-1.1596396

[Eric]

Here is a link to the entire lawsuit. Chock full of interesting nuggets

http://www.sportsmedia101.com/newyorkgiants/2014/01/30/eric-inselberg-vs-new-york-giants-read-the-entire-lawsuit/

[ousooner_85]

Eric....did you get the pm I sent you in the last week or two?

[Eric]

I did not.Let me check

[Eric]

Keith Olbermann did a segment on this tonight. Worth watching...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1YFtIeIIHcE&feature=youtu.be

[jbean023]

The mlb program is a great program but also has flaws as no one is perfect. From what I have learned most authenticators have some kind of law background but there's not, for what I know of, an authenticator school. What do they get a month training class? I dont agree with authenticating used jerseys, bats, helmets, ect as issued just because they didn't see them worn either don't hologram them at all and get a team LOA or get a professional and photo match them to at least one game especially the pinstripes jerseys,bats,and helmets. They would have access to team photographers, video, ect. They had issues with a lot of WBC balls last year. I caught a Nady pinstripe mlb authenticated to opening day and the jersey didn't match, sent back to Steiner for refund, they resold to Krukscards, I told Kruk when they listed on ebay and not sure what happened to the jersey after that. I own a lot of Steiner items and I stand by them as most their Cubs jerseys show way more use and match more often than Cubs team LOAs. NFL had a rough year with selling jerseys to the wrong game. I think someone passionate and educated about game used should start an authentication company, training employees correctly and go to as many sporting events as possible, and take over authentication for nfl,mlb,nhl,and nba. Back to the Eli case, I just had to chime in on the mlb authentication thoughts.

[metsbats]

I suspect the "authenticators" who work for mlb are just auditors whose sole purpose is to ensure that the item is taken directly from the field or clubhouse into the hands of the team store. So there is no real authentication or research done. I alos suspect items may be also "authenticated" after the fact so what the player gives the team to be sold really relies on the integrity of the player.

[mbenga28]

Is the collector mentioned in this article a member here?

http://nypost.com/2014/01/31/collector-fears-eli-cheated-him-with-fake-8500-rookie-helmet/

[allstarsplus]

I suspect the "authenticators" who work for mlb are just auditors whose sole purpose is to ensure that the item is taken directly from the field or clubhouse into the hands of the team store. So there is no real authentication or research done. I alos suspect items may be also "authenticated" after the fact so what the player gives the team to be sold really relies on the integrity of the player.

Funny you used the word "auditors". MLB they first began the authentication program used the accounting firm of Deloitte & Touche to handle the authenticators then switched to law enforcement backgrounds with training.

On the part I highlighted in red, if they don't see the jersey coming off their back or the jersey isn't pre-marked, then it's not supposed to be authenticated as "game used" and will get a "game issued" authentication instead.

The research they do is more with items used during the game like the chain of events on a game used baseball or a broken bat.

Authenticators who have come to our autograph signings have been very knowledgeable.

Honest mistakes do get made and they usually correct them when they are notified. We had a base with an incorrect game date. It turned out the entire game log had the wrong date where instead of Sept 25th it was entered as Aug 25th. They corrected it.

Now they are using scanners and more sophisticated ways to upload the information quicker.

The fact that they rotate authenticators and use multiple authenticators for key games also helps in the integrity and that there is also a review process daily in MLB Headquarters adds to how good the system really is.

I don't believe there is a better authentication system in pro sports and this should be the model for the NFL.

[allstarsplus]

Is the collector mentioned in this article a member here?

http://nypost.com/2014/01/31/collector-fears-eli-cheated-him-with-fake-8500-rookie-helmet/

This excerpt is scary

A former Steiner Sports employee said Thursday that staffers of the memorabilia seller suspected that not all of the “game-used” gear was real.

“Specifically, from Eli we would see it and say, ‘Come on, this is not ‘game used,’ ” the source said.

[allstarsplus]

Keith Olbermann did a segment on this tonight. Worth watching...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1YFtIeIIHcE&feature=youtu.be

Olbermann himself is a collector which has to turn his stomach too. CNN had Chris Nerat on talking about this and I'm sure this will be picked up by ESPN soon.

[mbenga28]

This excerpt is scary

A former Steiner Sports employee said Thursday that staffers of the memorabilia seller suspected that not all of the “game-used” gear was real.

“Specifically, from Eli we would see it and say, ‘Come on, this is not ‘game used,’ ” the source said.


I wonder if the same was said when they saw lightly used Jeter game used bats.

[GMEN92]

Is the collector mentioned in this article a member here?

http://nypost.com/2014/01/31/collector-fears-eli-cheated-him-with-fake-8500-rookie-helmet/

Was wondering the same thing...

[allstarsplus]

I wonder if the same was said when they saw lightly used Jeter game used bats.

Not sure if you are saying that tongue in cheek, but at least "Lightly used" is still game used vs. "fake use". A buyer who looks at light-use items has to make their decision based on use.

A few weeks ago I sold a Chien-Ming Wang Yankees BP jersey with all the game used authentication. The buyer received the jersey and says it has no use. Certainly "light use" but to say "no use" calls in question the authetication which was done by Steiner. I see these one game used TBTC jerseys all the time. The tagging is crisp and might have no dirt on it but you can still photomatch them. That's light use and very collectible. Collectors love the TBTC items.

The situation still is apples and oranges as light use is still game use and fake use is fraud.

[Steeleraddict]

Didn't josports get a ton of giants gear? I seem to recall them posting videos of getting boxes and boxes of " GU helmets"

[joelsabi]

Not sure if you are saying that tongue in cheek, but at least "Lightly used" is still game used vs. "fake use". A buyer who looks at light-use items has to make their decision based on use.

A few weeks ago I sold a Chien-Ming Wang Yankees BP jersey with all the game used authentication. The buyer received the jersey and says it has no use. Certainly "light use" but to say "no use" calls in question the authetication which was done by Steiner. I see these one game used TBTC jerseys all the time. The tagging is crisp and might have no dirt on it but you can still photomatch them. That's light use and very collectible. Collectors love the TBTC items.

The situation still is apples and oranges as light use is still game use and fake use is fraud.

im not a football collector, but i read that quote as saying, from reading other articles and the JO threads, that it is hard to fake football game use. there was a post by a member who played football in college or semi who stated that is hard to fake/duplicate actual use from the field with tools.

with lightly use, you do not have enough info to make a decision. with fake use, you see enough use to says this is not matching up to marking that should be on the jersey after a 250 lb linebackers hits them and the jersey is unwashed. There is just too much hd video out there not to matchup an unwashed jersey.

I have to give Eli the benefit of the doubt on this. Looking at the photo provided of him signing equipment tells me there is enough stuff out there that could possible be doctored without his knowledge. Inselberg seems to have a axe to grind and is pushing it. I hope Eli files a libel suit against him.

[Steeleraddict]

I'll hold off for with the he said, she said.

But obermann had the emails of the nyg staff stating which gear was "bs gear" and which wasn't. If real, difficult to refute.

Wont comment on the staff cutting and resewing "game use repairs".

Either way, this really hurts the hobby. as seems to occur year after year.

I'll just say, if proven, I'm not at all surprised. Disappointed but not surprised.

[GMEN92]

Joel..
I have ask as I'm a huge giants fan and collector, and have met eli on several occasions and have got stuff signed... Doesn't just a photo of him signing a helmet does not mean he had nothing to do with this..
I'm sure there's others like me who are now stuck what looks like to be a $5k paper weight .
You have to also look at it that he's signed the helmets in question here.. And inscribed them.. Game used.. Eli Manning.(superbowl season for mine)...
So for the helmets that are in question that have been made public they all have an inscription and auto...
As well as I have 4 coas from STEINER for my helmet and at this point they apparently mean nothing!! !

As well I find it odd how they have not come forward with a statement yet..

So yes there's alot of questions to be answered.. . And regardless who dislikes who.. There are other people/collectors involved here that spent there hard earned money and have been lied to as well as cheated..

And apparently the HOF Realizes it as well as they pulled down the plaque that was on the supposed eli superbowl 42 helmet...

[Roady]

Olbermann himself is a collector which has to turn his stomach too. CNN had Chris Nerat on talking about this and I'm sure this will be picked up by ESPN soon.

Olberman turns my stomach.

[HawaiiSportsNut]

They are talking about it on CNN right now.

[Eric]

Not saying anything about the helmets. Just showing that at 3:24 in this clip from October 2011 there's an Eli helmet which came from the team. Interesting to hear what Jarrod notices about the helmet.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sBcFPVAmfnE&feature=c4-overview&list=UUWjZ78ZvXXogKsjuYaVvLWg

[mbenga28]

Does this case first have to be decided first or can collectors who purchased Giants game worn begin to file suits now as well?

[joelsabi]

Back side

just an observation.

On the QB transmission sticker from the JO 2011 video posted by Eric look like this screenshot.

And GMEN92's helmet, the sticker is just blank Green.

I also looked at the 2008 Super Bowl and I was able to see the same sticker with the NFL insignia, like the JO video,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyzdxqNXBXw

[helmets]

just an observation.

On the QB transmission sticker from the JO 2011 video posted by Eric look like this screenshot.

And GMEN92's helmet, the sticker is just blank Green.



The first year or two that the NFL started using the decal, they were plain green.

[perlman9]

Hey Helmets
Can you shoot me an email at jperlman (at) ohaflcio.org thanks!

[joelsabi]

The first year or two that the NFL started using the decal, they were plain green.

thanks for the explanation.

Is there anything different about the QB helmet as opposed to his other teammates, such as communication mic to communicate with the coaches. What on the insides would be different?

[helmets]

Velcro to hold the communications speaker and battery pack. There is no microphone in the helmet.

[Phil316]

Not saying anything about the helmets. Just showing that at 3:24 in this clip from October 2011 there's an Eli helmet which came from the team. Interesting to hear what Jarrod notices about the helmet.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sBcFPVAmfnE&feature=c4-overview&list=UUWjZ78ZvXXogKsjuYaVvLWg

Interesting remark about the front bumper.

[GMEN92]

Yes correct there should be velcro stickers inside as well .. And
My helmet does NOT have them either.. Ughh

[mbenga28]

Is the complaint or other court documents related to this accessible publicly? I'd like to read more about this. Thanks.

[Eric]

Is the complaint or other court documents related to this accessible publicly? I'd like to read more about this. Thanks.

The entire complaint is on here.

http://www.sportsmedia101.com/newyorkgiants/2014/01/30/eric-inselberg-vs-new-york-giants-read-the-entire-lawsuit/

[helmet lover]

The first year or two that the NFL started using the decal, they were plain green.

Hi helmets,I need to ask you a question about a Oilers helmet that I bought off of ebay.The guy said he bought it from you.Please email me at brandonwatson77@yahoo.com Thanks,Brandon

[KGoldin]

Goldin Auctions wishes to inform everyone that any Eli Manning game used item currently for sale in its online auction catalog https://www.goldinauctions.com/catalog.aspx
has been photo matched and the matches have been posted

[allstarsplus]

Yes correct there should be velcro stickers inside as well .. And
My helmet does NOT have them either.. Ughh

GMen92, can you call me real quick. A journalist with a NY paper just called me about you and I didn't want to speak on your behalf.

[Phil316]

Goldin Auctions wishes to inform everyone that any Eli Manning game used item currently for sale in its online auction catalog https://www.goldinauctions.com/catalog.aspx
has been photo matched and the matches have been posted

Ken I love it ! Conclusive too.

[thesteelcurtain58]

I have a GU photo matched helmet with the Velcro stickers inside.
I've given up asking gmen asking for help with my potential fake Arizona fitz jersey. But good luck. Maybe to help himself...

[PAC]

Not saying anything about the helmets. Just showing that at 3:24 in this clip from October 2011 there's an Eli helmet which came from the team. Interesting to hear what Jarrod notices about the helmet.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sBcFPVAmfnE&feature=c4-overview&list=UUWjZ78ZvXXogKsjuYaVvLWg

Has the video been deleted? Whenever I try to play it, it goes to one about Raiders jerseys instead.

[Vikingshelmetguy]

Interestingly, and perhaps coincidentally, I've noticed a large number of Giants game worn helmets that have popped up for sale/been sold on Ebay over the last few weeks (check out the closed/sold listings on Ebay for Giants game helmet). They all appeared to be really real and legitimate game worn helmets to me… But hard to figure out now what's real or not real if it somehow turns out to be true that the Giants equipment personnel were doctoring up helmets...

[Phil316]

Has the video been deleted? Whenever I try to play it, it goes to one about Raiders jerseys instead.

No it is still up. Not sure why it is redirecting you.

[allstarsplus]

Has the video been deleted? Whenever I try to play it, it goes to one about Raiders jerseys instead.

Worked for me. Good view inside the Eli helmet from 2011. Not sure about the FedEx envelope Jarrod taped to his shirt though :rolleyes:

[BULBUS]

I have a 2000 Strahan white jersey that could have very well been doctored as described in the complaint. The repairs are clean and straight. I'll be following this story closely.

[Eric]

GMEN92 please email me as soon as you can at ecky3@aol.com
Thanks, Eric

[stonedylan]

I am having the same issue. Did you contact the person you purchased the helmet from?

[stonedylan]

That was for GMEN92. Wondering if you tried to contact the person that sold you the helmet. I have a 2005 helmet and have the same issues.

[GMEN92]

That was for GMEN92. Wondering if you tried to contact the person that sold you the helmet. I have a 2005 helmet and have the same issues.

Yes I did. Can you contact me Private message

[GMEN92]

Stone your private messages are blocked. .

[stonedylan]

try maushop@live.com

[gobigblue]

I have a GU photo matched helmet with the Velcro stickers inside.
I've given up asking gmen asking for help with my potential fake Arizona fitz jersey. But good luck. Maybe to help himself...

steelcurtain, what game was it from? I have an Eli helmet, supposed pulled after Pitt 2008 game, that he signed in front of me. It's got all the proper outside markings and velcro inside. In pouring over video from the game, I noticed that there is a hole (or black sticker) in the top of the inside of the helmet on video, that is NOT there on my helmet. Does anyone know what that hole/ sticker is for? Suspicious that my helmet has only all-white styrofoam in that spot?

Also, my helmet has a white scratch next to the NY logo on the left side. I'm not sure if one would be actually able to see this on video, but I could not find any sign of it on his helmet in the video, nor in the limited photos I could find.

Comments from the helmet experts ?

Also, GMEN92, I've PM'ed you twice. Any reply? Thanks,

Sam

[GMEN92]

Go big blue I responded to your PM twice already.. Did u check your folder? Let me know thanks

[gobigblue]

Got them now. Will communicate with you- thanks.

[kudu]

Fox News did a story earlier today on the Eli helmet, with Geraldo. Hopefully the situation gets worked out.

[Dach0sen0ne]

Geraldo will get to the bottom of it. haha

http://foxnewsinsider.com/2014/02/06/ny-giants-and-eli-manning-fight-memorabilia-lawsuit

[Phil316]

Geraldo will that's the thing now that this is gaining all this publicity it cannot just get swept under the carpet.

My real fear is people coming out of the wood work and making these types of claims about other teams/players. This could open a whole can of worms.

[allstarsplus]

Geraldo brings up a valid point on Eli's statement.

Again, this entire fiasco goes back to the fact that the NFL has no league-wide independent authentication system in place.

The MLB system was set up on the tenets used by CPAs in auditing for independent control and proper handling of inventory. As a CPA, I could set up a system that is as close to tamper proof as possible. Safeguards are put in place. The NFL must adopt this system. With my experience working directly with MLB Authenticators and now working inside the stadium, I am proud when I offer MLB authenticated items for sale because I have 100% confidence it is legitimate game used if the authentication says that. For the 1,000's of items we have handled, the issues are never on authenticity, just some minor issues on description. That's how the system is supposed to work and generally through research the descriptions are corrected.

While I have no direct knowledge of any of the questionable items here, I was contacted by a few journalists asking me specifically about authentication and how it works.

Any time the NFL wants to contact me on setting up an authentication system, my contact info is below ;)

[allstarsplus]

Michael O'keefe of the NY Daily News just contacted me on this story. He would like to hear from some of you that own substantial Giants collections with Eli Manning game used items in them.

He said I could post his phone number which is 917-796-9643

[GMEN92]

Thanks, I already spoke with him..

[allstarsplus]

Thanks, I already spoke with him..

Yes, he told me that. I'm glad you spoke to him.

I spoke to a gentleman with the last name of Lee who called me last week. I don't have your number but if you read this give Mr. O'Keefe a call. You had some good information.

[Phil316]

Bump

[Samets]

Looks like we have an update in this case (http://www.nj.com/giants/index.ssf/2014/11/giants_lose_again_memorabilia_dealer_wins_ruling_i n_eli_manning_fraud_case.html): "A federal judge in Newark ruled Tuesday that Eric Inselberg can proceed with his lawsuit in state court."

[danesei@yahoo.com]

Technically, I don't think it can be classified as a case, yet. All the judge did was determine the jurisdiction within which the case should be filed.

[Phil316]

UPDATE

http://www.sportsmedia101.com/newyorkgiants/2016/01/14/new-york-giants-eli-manning-must-face-fraud-claims-in-fake-memorabilia-case/

[mbenga28]

"...Joe Skiba sent Manning an email saying: “Let me know what your looking for I’ll try to get something down for you…”, court papers say.

“2 helmets that can pass as game used. That is it. Eli,” Manning allegedly responded from his BlackBerry at 2:08 p.m


http://nypost.com/2017/04/13/heres-proof-eli-manning-was-in-on-giants-memorabilia-scheme/

[ivo610]

"...Joe Skiba sent Manning an email saying: “Let me know what your looking for I’ll try to get something down for you…”, court papers say.

“2 helmets that can pass as game used. That is it. Eli,” Manning allegedly responded from his BlackBerry at 2:08 p.m


http://nypost.com/2017/04/13/heres-proof-eli-manning-was-in-on-giants-memorabilia-scheme/

They are so F'd. I hope Eric takes them to the cleaners.

[NEFAN]

What if anything do you think the NFL will do to Manning or the Giants? I know they are both NFL "royalty" so I figure they won't do anything. Thoughts?

[LarryWalkerFan]

They are so F'd. I hope Eric takes them to the cleaners.

Given Brandon isn't involved in the suit, I'm curious about his position on all of this. If Eric's claims are factual, wouldn't Brandon be the one who actually has a breach of contract suit to claim against Eli?

[Buccaneer Madden]

What if anything do you think the NFL will do to Manning or the Giants? I know they are both NFL "royalty" so I figure they won't do anything. Thoughts?

Nothing. Tom Brady would have been hung. :)

[NEFAN]

Nothing. Tom Brady would have been hung. :)

My thoughts exactly.

[ivo610]

Given Brandon isn't involved in the suit, I'm curious about his position on all of this. If Eric's claims are factual, wouldn't Brandon be the one who actually has a breach of contract suit to claim against Eli?

I think they need to sue to maintain face. I have a hard time understanding why they haven't made a public statement on this since they have the most to lose.

[yanks12025]

Wasn't there actually a case with a member years ago that bought a Brady jersey that said it was game used. But he found out it wasn't and actually made a deal to send it back to Brady and he wore it during s game. I remember a thread about it but can't find it.

[emann]

Wasn't there actually a case with a member years ago that bought a Brady jersey that said it was game used. But he found out it wasn't and actually made a deal to send it back to Brady and he wore it during s game. I remember a thread about it but can't find it.

I recall that thread too but couldn't find it . . .

I'd assume Steiner needs to do pursue some recourse here (probably waiting for the outcome)—it goes toward this incident possibly eroding trust in the authenticity of their items (certainly Manning ones).

But I'm more curious how this affects players and their items going forward. If Manning gets "in trouble" for keeping something that many players feel are already theirs (helmets, jerseys, etc)—will a majority of players start complaining about monetizing their equipment. I've heard there have been grumblings for years in baseball and they seem to be ramping up quick . . .

[Phil316]

http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_forum/showthread.php?t=37792&page=6&highlight=Tom+Brady+Game

Should be down the page a bit. Mulligans

"To make a long story short, the Jersey has since been washed and is presently hanging in Tom’s locker in Foxboro. My contact at the Pats has assured me that Tom will wear my Jersey on this Sunday against the Ravens or in 5 weeks when the Pats wear blue again and then it will be returned to me unwashed. I do not think that it was necessary to wear it again, but who wouldn’t take advantage of this type of opportunity!"

[ivo610]

Steiner addressed the issue a little bit today during a Facebook live feed. Basically said they are looking into it and no one should worry bc it's only a handful of items, "less than a dozen".

[LarryWalkerFan]

Last I heard, Steiner is offering full refunds up until a determination is made. I think it's good of him to step forward like this.