Team COA versus Proper Tagging

[EurekaDave]

How much do you trust a team COA. And how important are tagging and signs of wear.

I know of teams selling jerseys with a letterhead certificate of authencity. But collector friends say they avoid the jerseys because they have commercial number tags and show no wear.

The theory is that teams prepare jerseys for use by a player ("Team issued") but the player has not necessarily worn the jersey in a game. In fact, lack of wear would indicate that they might not have worn it at all; somehow the jersey made it from the stitching room to the locker room.

How comfortable are you with a team-issued COA? Or uncomfortable with retail tags?

Or is all this analogus to accepting the transplanted heart of a pig? ("It works for me!")

[sylbry]

I adhere to the philosophy that the jersey must speak for itself. Meaning anyone should be able to tell the jersey was worn by said player. It must have proper tagging and show consistent wear. Never would I believe a retail jersey was converted for game use, nor would I believe a jersey that was incorrectly tagged was game used, at least by a star caliber player (speaking for Twins jerseys only.) From my years of dealing with Twins jerseys the one thing I have found is jerseys that are close (ex: year tag only) are the ones that are most often fake. Jerseys consistently offered by one particular internet auction house come to mind.

I would purchase a Twins jersey that lack tagging provided two conditions are met. 1) It was purchased from the Twins Pro Shop and comes with the Twins LOA. 2) There is good reason why the tagging isn't there. For example I purchased a hall of famer spring training coaches jersey from the pro shop. The proper 0062 tag is attached but not the year, size, number tag.

Bryan

[kingjammy24]

i'd like to preface things by saying i think the title of this thread is a misnomer. it issue shouldn't be either a team coa or proper tagging. a jersey with a team coa should have proper tagging. if it doesn't there could be a myriad of legit explanations. ultimately it's up to you if you can accept having an anomaly (a jersey with improper tagging) in your collection.

"How much do you trust a team COA."

i don't trust a team implicitly on all issues. i think there are some things you can trust a team on and some that you can't.
i trust that a team is not doctoring jerseys. i trust that a team is not intentionally attempting to mislead buyers or commit fraud. i trust that 99% of the time a jersey coming directly from a team is either genuinely game-issued or game-worn.
that said, i don't trust that a team will always be correct in terms of designating exactly when a jersey was worn or whether a jersey was game-worn or just game-issued. teams make honest mistakes and sometimes they'll confuse jerseys or advertise a game-issued as a game-worn and vice versa. however, this is far better than you can expect from many dealers, auction houses, and even players.

"And how important are tagging and signs of wear."

very important.

"I know of teams selling jerseys with a letterhead certificate of authencity. But collector friends say they avoid the jerseys because they have commercial number tags and show no wear."

what's a "commercial number tag"?

if a jersey has team provenance and shows little or no wear, then it was most likely game-issued rather than "fake". i also avoid jerseys that show little or no wear. however, that's not to say i'd avoid a jersey with team provenance or that a team isn't a great place to obtain jerseys. it sounds like your friend has issues with a specific team, rather than with the notion of team provenance in general. to be honest, i can't think of a better place to buy a jersey than directly from a team. i believe they're less likely to engage in deceptive practices than the players themselves.

"The theory is that teams prepare jerseys for use by a player ("Team issued") but the player has not necessarily worn the jersey in a game. In fact, lack of wear would indicate that they might not have worn it at all; somehow the jersey made it from the stitching room to the locker room."

it's not unheard of for a team to err on the game-issued vs. game-worn issue. simply use your own judgement in gauging the wear. at worst, you'll end up with a legit game-issued jersey that you'll likely be able to return. can you say the same for any other source? in most cases when you aren't buying from a team, the worst you can end up with is a doctored retail jersey that you won't be able to return.

"How comfortable are you with a team-issued COA?"

assuming the COA isn't forged and corresponds to the proper jersey, then i'm very comfortable. i can use my own judgement to gauge the wear. i'm fairly confident the team isn't doctoring jerseys or deliberately defrauding the public.

"Or uncomfortable with retail tags?"

under no circumstances would i ever purchase a jersey with retail tags. a jersey could come with a team coa, notarized and sworn statement from the equipment manager, and a personal appearance from the player himself swearing he wore the jersey, but if it had retail tags i still wouldn't buy it.
if a team is selling a retail jersey as a gamer then i can only assume that a promo/photoshoot jersey accidentally got mixed into the bunch.

rudy.

[RKGIBSON]

Only speaking of NFL jerseys, I have purchased over 30 directly from NFL auctions or directly from team stores or auctions and they have always been exactly what they represented them as. I stress the word DIRECTLY.

A few years back I bought a Steve Young jersey with a 49er letter. When I got the jersey there were things that made it suspect, due to the fact that I had 2 others that came directly from the team. The letter was a copy and the jersey was not real. The trophys at the bottom of the page were not embossed and there was no notary seal. The water mark and weight of the paper was different than all the other team letters I had. When confronted the auction company returned my money.

If you deal directly with teams, or leagues, I believe that is the best way. I will buy if paperwork is present and if ownership of the item can be proved back to the team or I am give guarantee of satisfaction.

Roger

[kingjammy24]

just wanted to add a bit more about team provenance;

while some teams may sometimes accidentally confuse some of their items, i think for the most part they're a fantastic source. i'd be a little more careful with team employees acting privately however. i've little doubt that there are some individuals employed with teams that take advantage of their situation in order to profit and commit fraud.

anyway, here's an odd jersey with a team loa:
http://img120.imageshack.us/img120/1263/fiskok0.jpg

it's a 1990 fisk, at gfc, with "team loa". the strange thing is that in 1990, the nobs on the road jerseys were arched. (in 1991, they sported redesigned road jerseys). additionally, the sox stopped using strip tags as seen in the gfc jersey in 1987 (or 88?). they didn't use strip tags in 1989 or 1990. the jersey is so odd that even the team loa can't make up for it.
perhaps the jersey was a promo shirt. perhaps some team employee stole a stack of letterhead and made up a bunch of loas. who knows. in this case, the jersey doesn't stand on it's own and, for me personally, the team loa doesn't account for or overcome the anomalies.

rudy.