shipment damaged?

[momen55]

has this happened to anyone before? i bought a bat from ebay and received info that it had been sent. i tracked it and indeed it was. 3 days later i tracked it again, but noticed that the info read, "Dead Mail / Sent to Mail Recovery Center".
i called the post office to find out what that means and she told me that the label more than likely got torn off during shipment probably due to damage so they couldn't deliver nor return to sender. it was sent to the recovery center in Tennessee.
has this happened to anyone here before? what recourse do i have? refund from seller then he gets reimbursed from postal service? what?:confused:

[CampWest]

I once had a bat get lost in transit. The triangular tube was shredded and looked like it was run over by a train. Bat was completely gone, but I did get the empty box delivered to my house. Emailed seller and no questions asked he refunded my money immediately. Took the trashed box to PO and they were appalled that the mailman left that at my door without any explanation.

I sent a message and photos to the local PO and the recovery center and never got a response.

I'd file the claim with the seller. Hopefully it was insured for the seller's side, but even if not insured you should get your money back.

[suave1477]

I once had a bat get lost in transit. The triangular tube was shredded and looked like it was run over by a train. Bat was completely gone, but I did get the empty box delivered to my house. Emailed seller and no questions asked he refunded my money immediately. Took the trashed box to PO and they were appalled that the mailman left that at my door without any explanation.

I sent a message and photos to the local PO and the recovery center and never got a response.

I'd file the claim with the seller. Hopefully it was insured for the seller's side, but even if not insured you should get your money back.

I am very much Momen sympathetic to your situation and I am sorry to hear of this. But I do disagree with this comment. Yes definitely make the seller aware of what is going on and maybe he did provide some type of insurance. But realistically the bat should of been insured if you specifically asked the seller to insure it and either you paid for it to be insured or he/she agreed to pay for the insurance. As far as the seller refunding your money (which is what I assuming Campwest is referring to?) If the seller does so, thats great but I dont see him being responsible to refund the money for something he didnt do. The Post Office for whatever reason lost, misplaced, or decided not to send your item. This is their responsibility not the sellers. Again if the seller decides he wants to intervene and refund your money thats great!! But he shouldnt be held accountable for actions of someone else.

[trsent]

I am very much Momen sympathetic to your situation and I am sorry to hear of this. But I do disagree with this comment. Yes definitely make the seller aware of what is going on and maybe he did provide some type of insurance. But realistically the bat should of been insured if you specifically asked the seller to insure it and either you paid for it to be insured or he/she agreed to pay for the insurance. As far as the seller refunding your money (which is what I assuming Campwest is referring to?) If the seller does so, thats great but I dont see him being responsible to refund the money for something he didnt do. The Post Office for whatever reason lost, misplaced, or decided not to send your item. This is their responsibility not the sellers. Again if the seller decides he wants to intervene and refund your money thats great!! But he shouldnt be held accountable for actions of someone else.

The seller is responsible for delivery, no questions asked. The seller has a choice to insure the package or self insure, but the buyer doesn't have to request insurance - ever!

It is against eBay rules to charge extra for insurance (even though you can add it to quoted shipping) but you cannot ever state you charge extra for insurance.

The seller is 100% responsible the customer gets their merchandise or a refund. The buyer here has done nothing wrong and isn't responsible for a poorly packaged parcel with or without insurance.

eBay 100% protects all buyers and in this situation Ivan has done nothing wrong and advising him that he may be responsible is irresponsible.

To make it 100% clear - Buyers do not have to ask for insurance on eBay and sellers are not allowed to charge extra for insurance on eBay. The package is the responsibility of the seller to be sure it is delivered or they have to give the buyer a 100% refund - No exceptions, no blaming it on the post office, no excuses.

This is how it is.

[camarokids]

It is time you learned how eBay works - The seller is responsible for delivery, no questions asked. The seller has a choice to insure the package or self insure, but the buyer doesn't have to request insurance - ever!

It is against eBay rules to charge extra for insurance (even though you can add it to quoted shipping) but you cannot ever state you charge extra for insurance.

The seller is 100% responsible the customer gets their merchandise or a refund. The buyer here has done nothing wrong and isn't responsible for a poorly packaged parcel with or without insurance.

When you try to chime in on a situation, you should offer facts based on how something works and not your own opinion because eBay 100% protects all buyers and in this situation Ivan has done nothing wrong and advising him that he may be responsible is irresponsible.

To make it 100% clear - Buyers do not have to ask for insurance on eBay and sellers are not allowed to charge extra for insurance on eBay. The package is the responsibility of the seller to be sure it is delivered or they have to give the buyer a 100% refund - No exceptions, no blaming it on the post office, no excuses.

This is how it is.

Exactly, just file a claim with paypal. End of story for the buyer. As for the seller, they can try and get their money back from the post office or paypal through seller protection.

[CampWest]

I am very much Momen sympathetic to your situation and I am sorry to hear of this. But I do disagree with this comment. Yes definitely make the seller aware of what is going on and maybe he did provide some type of insurance. But realistically the bat should of been insured if you specifically asked the seller to insure it and either you paid for it to be insured or he/she agreed to pay for the insurance. As far as the seller refunding your money (which is what I assuming Campwest is referring to?) If the seller does so, thats great but I dont see him being responsible to refund the money for something he didnt do. The Post Office for whatever reason lost, misplaced, or decided not to send your item. This is their responsibility not the sellers. Again if the seller decides he wants to intervene and refund your money thats great!! But he shouldnt be held accountable for actions of someone else.


Nope... I am right on this one. As was explained by trsent, eBay's rules clearly state that seller is responsible until delivery has been accepted. Risk of Ownership in most sales of goods does not transfer until delivery has been made. I am not a lawyer, but I believe that the seller is responsible for shipment, unless the terms of sale specifically state that ownership transfers upon leaving the seller's possession. The seller hired the shipper. Therefore the failure of delivery is a matter between the seller and their hired shipper. The buyer is not responsible for the transaction between the seller and shipper.

The shipping insurance is for the seller's protection, not the buyer's.

[trsent]

The shipping insurance is for the seller's protection, not the buyer's.

Never a better quote for the modern seller on eBay.

[momen55]

i emailed the seller to let him know what happened and he refunded in full with no questions asked. he emailed and stated he was going to find out what happened and try to get the bat back, if it didn't get destroyed in the process.
it was a knobless model i don't have, but at least i received my money back.

[suave1477]

Just to explain to everyone else I was not speaking of from a "EBAY RULES" point of view more of just a mere morals point a view.

I personally could not hold someone else accountable for actions they didnt do. But hey thats just me!!

Ebay rules or not. I still have a conscience

[slab0meat]

Just to explain to everyone else I was not speaking of from a "EBAY RULES" point of view more of just a mere morals point a view.

I personally could not hold someone else accountable for actions they didnt do. But hey thats just me!!

Ebay rules or not. I still have a conscience


(Sorry to interject here) -- suave1477, did you get my email about payment, along with a question? Haven't heard back. Thanks!

[suave1477]

(Sorry to interject here) -- suave1477, did you get my email about payment, along with a question? Haven't heard back. Thanks!

Sorry no I haven't, can you email me suave1477@yahoo.com thanks:)

[slab0meat]

Sorry no I haven't, can you email me suave1477@yahoo.com thanks:)


Sent again about an hour ago.....

[suave1477]

I have asked the forum moderators to review the comments by Jason towards me and to take appropriate action. I simply replied correcting the errors of his post misleading an honest member of the forum and I would appreciate Jason keeping his rude attacks off the forum from now on.

I do not appreciate when I comment as part of a discussion my reply is ignored and considered an attack instead of this adult just admitting they were wrong grossly misleading someone with their reply to their post. Misinformation and misleading advice could cost someone money when they are not responsible for a lost shipment per eBay policy.

Jason, please be an adult and apologize for your personal attack towards me and either admit you were wrong with your original post or stop making the situation worse by attacking me personally instead of discussing the issues at hand?

Ok here we go!!

You simply replied correcting what errors????? My morals are errors??? Now you think your god? Sorry never saw a picture of you in the bible, Karan, or Torah.

How dare you feel you can correct my morals? I simply stated I was referring to My morals not "EBAYS RULES"

Mislead someone? Who did I mislead I thought the original poster said this situation already took place? Cant go back in time and change what already happened.
If anything I provided educational information to protect a buyers oneself by making an effort to implying to a seller he would like insurance on an item.

You want me to apologize, when you attacked me first as always?? Your like the guy who kicks a dog and when the dog bites back calls animal control.

You want to bring this topic to the MODS attention by all means go ahead. Did you bring to there attention why you havent been banned for the no advertising rule which you have ignored for years???

[suave1477]

RULE #4
No Advertising or Website Promotion. Please do not post any messages anywhere on this site that are primarily for the promotion or advertising of any website, item for sale (other than in the 'Collector to Collector Classifieds' section as per its rules), forum, email address, business, multi-level marketing activity or other entity without prior approval from Game Used Universe.



Joel Alpert
AM Sports Marketing Group

This is your signature correct? Meanwhile you have had this signature on under your name for years on this forum and it hasn't change. Or as at the end of the rule you have approval?
If so is there a reason why you have special approval over others who would like to advertise?

[xpress34]

Suave -

Be careful how you tread. Joel got into a heated debate with Sammy in the autograph section about a year ago and Sammy was (and still is) banned.

Joel? Not even a slap on the wrist. Mods kept claiming he would be banned as well, but I checked everyday for weeks until I got tired of checking. Not even a one day ban for Joel.

He's deep with someone in power, because I have yet to ever see him get in trouble for anything he does here - only the people he drags into his net. And people wonder why the old timer's and good guys left this board voluntarily.


- Smitty

P.S. -

Joel (or anyone else here) -

For FACTUAL information, could someone post a link to the eBay shipping RULE that states what Joel claims as fact?

I did a search on eBay and it takes you to 'answers' from eBay Sellers and Buyers, but I couldn't find on eBay's new convoluted site a direct link to any selling RULES regarding Insurance.

I am simply asking for a LINK that shows this stated by eBay (the company) in black and white.

I have always listed with Free Shipping and Insurance Optional and have never had an issue. My last auctions were about 3-4 months ago, so if this has changed since then, I would just like to see the actual RULE.

Thanks.

- Smitty


RULE #4
No Advertising or Website Promotion. Please do not post any messages anywhere on this site that are primarily for the promotion or advertising of any website, item for sale (other than in the 'Collector to Collector Classifieds' section as per its rules), forum, email address, business, multi-level marketing activity or other entity without prior approval from Game Used Universe.



Joel Alpert
AM Sports Marketing Group

This is your signature correct? Meanwhile you have had this signature on under your name for years on this forum and it hasn't change. Or as at the end of the rule you have approval?
If so is there a reason why you have special approval over others who would like to advertise?

[Dach0sen0ne]

Joel (or anyone else here) -

For FACTUAL information, could someone post a link to the eBay shipping RULE that states what Joel claims as fact?

I did a search on eBay and it takes you to 'answers' from eBay Sellers and Buyers, but I couldn't find on eBay's new convoluted site a direct link to any selling RULES regarding Insurance.

I am simply asking for a LINK that shows this stated by eBay (the company) in black and white.

I have always listed with Free Shipping and Insurance Optional and have never had an issue. My last auctions were about 3-4 months ago, so if this has changed since then, I would just like to see the actual RULE.

Thanks.

- Smitty

http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/selling-practices.html

Click on "Shipping and Handling Costs" and then look at "What you're not allowed to charge"

[xpress34]

By the way - for Historical and Factual Reference, here is the link where Greg stated that BOTH members would be suspended:

Ruth, opinons please thread - post #31 (http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_forum2/showpost.php?p=5902&postcount=31)

The two individuals referenced were Sammy and Trsent.

As I stated earlier, Sammy is still banned and Joel - not even a slap on the wrist.

The thread - in it's entirety - may be read here:

Ruth, opinons please (http://www.gameuseduniverse.com/vb_forum2/showthread.php?t=1790)

- Smitty

[xpress34]

http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/selling-practices.html

Click on "Shipping and Handling Costs" and then look at "What you're not allowed to charge"

Thank you! I was looking for that forever yesterday, but when I did a search on eBay it took me to the 'questions' area which are answered by other users.

All the best -

Smitty

[xpress34]

At the risk of really starting something here - and due to the nature of the linked thread having to do with Authenticators - does anyone else find it an interesting juxtaposition that some here 'champion' the cause of the Authenticators AND 'champion' that SHIPPERS are responsible for Insuring what they ship, yet Authenticators (such as PSA/DNA) make YOU as the 'purchaser' (i.e. buyer) of their services pay to insure your stuff BOTH directions.

As the Shipper and the Receiver, PSA/DNA at NO time (even as the shipper returning your item) ever pays for the Insurance. That is on YOU as the 'buyer' of their service.

Check their charts - you have to declare a value and pay for shipping that covers insurance up to that declared value.

I just thought it was an interesting change of perspective on this argument.

This means they are NEVER responsible for your items care or how it ends up in shipping.

Just my .02

- Smitty

[trsent]

I'm not going to get into a debate here. I show my company name in every post as it is my signature. I am not promoting my sports marketing company with my signature - No one here is looking for book appearances for Chicago based athletes, are they? It is my name and company name - I am not promoting anything other than attaching a company name to my name as that is who I am. No links to my business as I am not here to promote my sports marketing group. There is no issue with this.

As for the Sammy debate - Sam Johnson was not a real person - He was a fake persona, aka Stephen Koschal who court systems removed his web site because he was found in the wrong. For years he posted here and when it was time to prove he was a real person he couldn't.

You all can gang attack me, but my points were eBay rules based and moral issues aside - No buyer should be left holding a finical loss for a package that wasn't delivered no matter what the reason. Buyers do not have to ask for insurance when ordering an item on eBay - It is eBay's rules to protect buyers.

It sucks for sellers, but that is how it is and guess what - In the real world of mail order that is how it works also.

I'm glad to hear the money was refunded to the buyer and I am sorry if anyone thought I was attacking their post - I was just posting facts based on how eBay operates in 2012. I appreciate the link to show it is against eBay rules to charge extra for insurance - This policy as been in place for a few years now.

Personally, each and every listing I have is 100% free shipping within the USA and we bend over backwards to make sure customer are satisfied because that is what eBay asks of all sellers here in 2012.

I am sorry if anyone misunderstood my original post, but it was not meant to be an attack or a debate over morals - I was simply posting eBay policies to make sure everyone understood the buyer isn't liable for a lost shipment no matter what the rationale.

[CampWest]

Here is another direct link...

http://pages.ebay.com/help/pay/shipping-problems.html

2nd paragraph...

Remember, the seller is responsible for the item until it is in the buyer's possession. eBay protects buyers (http://pages.ebay.com/help/buy/protection-programs.html) if items arrive damaged, and sellers should consider insuring their items to protect themselves against loss.