Albert Pujols to the Angels

[gorilla777]

Wow

[happyyoungster]

"Wow" is right...this is huge.
Knowing the Cardinals-they'll defy the odds once again.

[BULBUS]

WOW! After AROD, I cant believe any team would give out a contract like that????

[cliffjmp33]

+1 on all the wows. I feel bad for Cardinal fans losing a great player though.

[happyyoungster]

+1 on all the wows. I feel bad for Cardinal fans losing a great player though.



But, you can feel good for all the Brewers fans. I was growing tired of that guy stomping us all the time.

[schubert1970]

-10

A sad day for baseball. I guess Albert can build a few more missions.

[cliffjmp33]

But, you can feel good for all the Brewers fans. I was growing tired of that guy stomping us all the time.

Fair enough, I feel good for all the Brewers, Astros, Pirates and Cobs fans! ;)

[SkubeBats]

Glad to see him out of the National League. As a Brewers fan I'm glad that he's no longer a Cardinal.............

[flota89]

And yesterday it looked like the Cardinals were almost certain to sign him.

I saw a report that the Angels hadn't even contacted him until the last 48 hours.

Wow is correct.

[allstarsplus]

Totally shocked. I thought for sure it was to get the Cardinals to move and Albert would stay in St. Louis. Amazing fact on Pujols, he never made over $14.6 million in a season over his entire 11 year career with the Cardinals.

Most baseball players are overpaid for what they really do but in comparison to the rest of the league, Albert was one of the most underpaid players over his 11 year history compared to his WAR. I really don't blame him for leaving. At some point it has to be upsetting on why your own team won't pay you. In his last contract he gave the Cardinals a huge hometown discount.

With that said, only time will tell if this works out for the Angels on the field. Off the field and in the box office, this is as big as it gets!

My first call after hearing the news was to my friend who is a principal in Art of the Game which is the stadium store for the Angels who sells the game used.

Just think of the calls they will be getting for Pujols jerseys! I already put in my request for Albert's first jersey. Everyone else get in line!

[yanks12025]

And no one will say that the Angels are buying their team or what ever like people do with the Yankees. The Angels just signed Wilson also, thats not buying a team.

[xpress34]

And no one will say that the Angels are buying their team or what ever like people do with the Yankees. The Angels just signed Wilson also, thats not buying a team.

I'll say it - The Angels are BUYING a team.

And I'll also say - not that I didn't expect his true colors to come out - but AP is a liar just like Clemens, A-Rod and all the others with their '"It's not about the money" BS.

Pujols Contract Remarks (http://thecardinalnationblog.com/2011/02/16/pujols-contract-remarks-from-spring-2009-and-2010/)

What a bunch of crap... I hope the Rangers trounce the Angels in their division AGAIN!

[r_phelps]

Wow..just last night the MLB network was saying that the Cardinals were a couple million away from a deal.

[OaklandAsFan]

I'll say it - The Angels are BUYING a team.

And I'll also say - not that I didn't expect his true colors to come out - but AP is a liar just like Clemens, A-Rod and all the others with their '"It's not about the money" BS.

Pujols Contract Remarks (http://thecardinalnationblog.com/2011/02/16/pujols-contract-remarks-from-spring-2009-and-2010/)

What a bunch of crap... I hope the Rangers trounce the Angels in their division AGAIN!


Its gonna take some astronomical good luck on the rest of the AL West and some horrible luck on the Angels for them to not walk away with the division for at least the next 2-3 years

[r_to_the_2nd@yahoo.com]

Go Reds! Pujoles is gone, we need to make a big splash that'll put the Reds back on top of the division!

[xpress34]

Its gonna take some astronomical good luck on the rest of the AL West and some horrible luck on the Angels for them to not walk away with the division for at least the next 2-3 years

Really? Wow, I guess the Rangers being back to back AL Champs was only because the AL West was weak... they didn't beat the teams from other divisions as well in route to those titles.

Time will tell...

[CampWest]

Angels two signings today = a higher per year salary on two players than the entire Royals payroll.

Although they were already 4 times higher before this morning.

Hunter and Wells > Royals payroll.

Abreu + Haren + Weaver + Santana > Royals payroll.

oh well... I should quit baseball. Really no fairness or competitive balance. And that looks like it will never change. If they did institute a salary cap, they would place it at something like 175-190 mil and the Royals would never have higher than 60-70 mil anyways.

[frikativ54]

I already put in my request for Albert's first jersey. Everyone else get in line!

I wish you luck on getting Pujols's first Angels' jersey. However, I don't think it will have nearly the monetary value as his Cards jerseys if he had stayed in St. Louis. But regardless, I hope you enjoy the shirt. :)

As for Albert himself, I agree with Smitty. If I were a Cards fan I would feel really betrayed. Pujols sacrificed team loyalty and went for the highest dollar. I really don't like what he did.

What really makes me mad is how he told the Cardinals' fans at the WS Parade how he wanted to stay in St. Louis. Another line from an insincere athlete going blind from the dollar signs in his eyes.

One of the qualities I admire most in athletes is team loyalty. You play the game for the fans; they are the ones who truly pay your salary. It's really sad that few pro athletes play their entire career for one team anymore.

That's why I admire people like Craig Biggio and Jeff Bagwell. They wanted to win in Houston and could have left and gotten more money elsewhere. But they loved their town and their team and wouldn't do that to the fans.

This is a sad day for baseball. And I will make sure to make my disapproval known when the Angels come to Seattle next year.

[coxfan]

I recently read a column (was it Gammons?) that said the Angels' leadership was furious over losing supremacy to the Rangers, and that heads had rolled because of it.

But don't overlook that the Rangers and Rays have shown that high-paid free agents aren't essential. Everyone thought that the Rangers' loss of Cliff Lee was devastating, but they finished #2 in the AL regular season, and rolled to the AL title, despite that. A group of overachievers like Napoli can be worth as much as one free agent.

[lakeerie92]

Totally shocked. I thought for sure it was to get the Cardinals to move and Albert would stay in St. Louis. Amazing fact on Pujols, he never made over $14.6 million in a season over his entire 11 year career with the Cardinals.

Most baseball players are overpaid for what they really do but in comparison to the rest of the league, Albert was one of the most underpaid players over his 11 year history compared to his WAR. I really don't blame him for leaving. At some point it has to be upsetting on why your own team won't pay you. In his last contract he gave the Cardinals a huge hometown discount.

With that said, only time will tell if this works out for the Angels on the field. Off the field and in the box office, this is as big as it gets!

My first call after hearing the news was to my friend who is a principal in Art of the Game which is the stadium store for the Angels who sells the game used.

Just think of the calls they will be getting for Pujols jerseys! I already put in my request for Albert's first jersey. Everyone else get in line!

I initially wondered how the memorabilia market on Pujols would change with a different team.

I think Albert has a lock on his memorabilia and that is why you never see a Pujols authenticated by MLB for game use. The only way I could see no one having authenticated Pujols bats (other than the signature) is if he had a strong grip on his memorabilia. The 3HR bat on MLB's authentication page didn't even show a hologram on it.

[bronx_burner]

Fair enough, I feel good for all the Brewers, Astros, Pirates and Cobs fans! ;)

Ah, but you can only feel good for the Astros for 2012! After that, they are right back to facing Pujols, and actually more times than before as the division will have 5 teams instead of 6.

[gingi79]

One of the qualities I admire most in athletes is team loyalty. You play the game for the fans; they are the ones who truly pay your salary. It's really sad that few pro athletes play their entire career for one team anymore.

That's why I admire people like Craig Biggio and Jeff Bagwell. They wanted to win in Houston and could have left and gotten more money elsewhere. But they loved their town and their team and wouldn't do that to the fans.

I respectively disagree for 2 reasons.

1) After any major baseball strike, when they didn't play for awhile and fans stayed away in droves when baseball returned, did contracts drop? No, they did not.

2) I'm disappointed by Pujols signing with another team as well but we as fans need to get over our self indulgence. Players play for themselves, for a title, for their family, for god and for money. Fans are just people who pay for the pleasure of seeing them play for those reasons. PR directors have taught these spoiled monkeys to say they care for the fans but you would be hard pressed in today's sports world to find too many who really believe that anymore. Of course that is my opinion, backed up by the fact I can name hundreds of all stars who left for the money but less than 10 players who stayed on one team in any sport and didn't take the money and run.

It also disturbs me that many of the people who hate their players leaving for money are guilty of it in their own lives. Know anyone who left their job for a higher paying one or a promotion to a better company? I have personally, so what is the difference? The fact it's millions of dollars versus thousands of dollars for a needy family is the reply I always get to this argument but to use that as an excuse is mere semantics. I can't be mad at someone doing what I do just because I will miss their talent on a team I root for.

I don't know enough about Biggio and Bagwell to comment with any authority but taking what you said at face value, they are the exception not the rule. Much like Cal Ripken, a first ballot HOF who spent hours signing autographs for fans at every game, I'd rather praise him for what he did that ping others for not doing it.

It's obvious the disconnect between fans and their heroes just continues to grow.

[emann]

Players play for themselves, for a title, for their family, for god and for money.

This is in no particular order, right? ;)

[sox83cubs84]

I''m figuring that there are going to be some Ballhawks in mourning here in Chi-Town over this signing. Pujols, far more often than not, unloaded on the street during BP, and, the shagger-unfriendly 2011 season notwithstanding, was generally good for a couple of game home runs a year. Now he'll be on a team that will be going to the Cell for one, maybe 2 series a year, in a park that doesn't present the advantages of freedom of movement and limited competiton that Waveland Avenue offers. No sympathy for the Waveland crowd here, though...the game last home run ball that Pujols hit onto the street was recently seen for sale on eBay at $9,500 OBO...the seller, and a fellow ballhawk, paid $100 for it and ripped some poor guy off terribly. When stuff like that is eliminated, the hobby as a whole is better for it.

Dave Miedema

[gorilla777]

Hey Dave,

I have 4 season seats for the Angels if you need another outlet to do your BP ballhawking for him, just let me know. ;)

Ben

[freddiefreeman5]

I would say the DH had something to do with his choice also.

















DD

[LastingsMilledge85]

The DH idea is something really to consider, after all the Miami Marlins did offer Pujols the most money.

[kellsox]

Really? Wow, I guess the Rangers being back to back AL Champs was only because the AL West was weak... they didn't beat the teams from other divisions as well in route to those titles.

Time will tell...

In 2011
Rangers were 40-17 vs AL West

56-49 vs everyone else

[gnishiyama]

Originally Posted by frikativ54
That's why I admire people like Craig Biggio and Jeff Bagwell. They wanted to win in Houston and could have left and gotten more money elsewhere. But they loved their town and their team and wouldn't do that to the fans.frikativ: How do you know this? Have they personally told you this?
Have you perhaps considered they stayed for themselves? Some players
care more about their legacy than money, some don't want to move
their families, some are just comfortable staying where they are. Others may
see future job opportunities after their playing days are over if they stick
with one team. Others might benefit by getting more endorsements.
Do you think Ripken would have been able to start his memorabilia
company had he changed teams during his consecutive games run
and other milestones? He is one of many, including MY favorite player Jeter,
who has benefited from staying with one team...You can interpret this
as loyalty to the fans but I am not so naive... however I still enjoy
watching the baseball and I don't mind spending my hard earned dollars on
going to a ballgame and having a good time.


It also disturbs me that many of the people who hate their players leaving for money are guilty of it in their own lives. Know anyone who left their job for a higher paying one or a promotion to a better company? I have personally, so what is the difference? The fact it's millions of dollars versus thousands of dollars for a needy family is the reply I always get to this argument but to use that as an excuse is mere semantics. I can't be mad at someone doing what I do just because I will miss their talent on a team I root for. Thanks Gingi for stating this.

Fans always act like these players should play for less than their value because
they make millions and if it weren't for the fans..blah blah blah

As Andrew noted Pujols has been one of the most underpaid players for
years. Good for him for getting his worth and in my opinion, and then
some to make up for those underpaid years!

And for those always complaining about the plight of their small market
teams...be thankful for revenue sharing or else there probably wouldn't
even be a team in your small market city. In my opinion MLB is watered down
with all these teams and would be better off without some of these teams anyways...
Pujols Angels products selling out means money for everyone!

I just hope the Cards fans appreciate Pujols for what he did.

[legaleagle92481]

Its gonna take some astronomical good luck on the rest of the AL West and some horrible luck on the Angels for them to not walk away with the division for at least the next 2-3 years

See 2011 Boston Red Sox
2011 Philadelphia Eagles

Most of the time the big money spending sprees go bust. Compare Rangers and Angels rosters. Top to bottom Texas has them beat still. Wilson is highly overrated and Albert won't have much help in the lineup.

[Birdbats]

I'm disappointed Pujols will not be on the Cardinals in 2012, 2013 and 2014. On the other hand, I'm relieved we won't be paying him $20-25M a year from 2015-21. I do appreciate everything he did for the Cardinals, and I respect that he never held out to renegotiate the contract he signed in 2004. In hindsight, he was a bargain... but you have to remember how groundbreaking it was for a fourth-year player to sign a 7-year, $100M contract. A smarter agent might have negotiated a 4-5 year contract so that Pujols would be younger when hitting the open market (can you imagine the contract he could have demanded after consecutive MVP seasons in 2008-09?). But, who knew then that he'd be ALBERT PUJOLS? That's ancient history. Bottom line, he was great in St. Louis and now he's in LA. That's his prerogative. The Cardinals were winners before Albert and they'll be winners again. I'm excited to see where the team goes from here.

[shoremen44]

Jeff... Very well said

[both-teams-played-hard]

Bottom line, he was great in St. Louis and now he's in LA. The Angels DO NOT play in Los Angeles. Very well said, however. It would be great if St. Louis won it all next season.:)

[Birdbats]

The Angels DO NOT play in Los Angeles.

I meant to say the Los Angeles Orange County California Angels of Anaheim. Sorry. :D

Here's what's important about LA -- Albert's agent is based in LA and people close to Albert told me long ago that his agent wanted Albert in LA. More marketing and "branding" opportunities there than in STL. Could see it starting a few months ago when Pujols' new logo and Kobe-influenced website were unveiled. I truly believe if Albert's agent was anyone other than Dan Lozano that he would have re-signed with STL long ago.

[Fnazxc0114]

I was hoping somebody would say it. Kinsler/hamilton/young/napoli/beltre/cruz. The rangers will be fine. CJ wilson was a drain on the clubhouse so it will be good having him gone. As far as who posted the rangers record against the west, you have to look at the fact that the west also had some of the best pitching in baseball. John Daniels is one of the best GM's in baseball, and I think he will come with something to make the team better.

See 2011 Boston Red Sox
2011 Philadelphia Eagles

Most of the time the big money spending sprees go bust. Compare Rangers and Angels rosters. Top to bottom Texas has them beat still. Wilson is highly overrated and Albert won't have much help in the lineup.

[kudu]

LA/Anaheim has a very large hispanic community. The revenue Pujols will generate for the Angels and MLB will be HUGE. I think the Angels got a bargain.

[Rob L]

Ahh, greatest day in a long, long time. Last time I was this geeked was when the Angels pulled Vladdy out of nowhere.

[Rboitano]

I bet scioscia will love to see Pujols not hustle out of the batters box like his lazy ass did here. He said god would show him where to go, I guess that meant where the most money was.

[LastingsMilledge85]

I bet scioscia will love to see Pujols not hustle out of the batters box like his lazy ass did here. He said god would show him where to go, I guess that meant where the most money was.

Again, Miami offered Pujols more money than LAA.

[70to66]

I agree with what Jeff said (birdbats) when he signed the previous contract it was good at the time, and nobody forced him to sign it. I wish him the best, but think the Cardinals got the best years of his career. I don't think he will last ten years and be productive.

[Rob L]

I think the deciding factor wasn't the money (Miami's offer was much higher, allegedly), it was the no-trade clause.

[3arod13]

I would say the DH had something to do with his choice also.















DD

Bingo!!!!

[AstrosGU]

Fair enough, I feel good for all the Brewers, Astros, Pirates and Cobs fans! ;)

Don't feel good for the Astros! Just keeps getting worse for us.

First MLB forces us to move to the AL West, then the cherry on top is Pujols is headed to the AL West as well.

[frikativ54]

Post of the day on facebook from the St. Louis Cards Rally Squirrel account: "Sorry, I got hit by the solid gold car that Pujols just bought as he sped out of town heading out to LA." :p

[frikativ54]

No sympathy for the Waveland crowd here, though...the game last home run ball that Pujols hit onto the street was recently seen for sale on eBay at $9,500 OBO...the seller, and a fellow ballhawk, paid $100 for it and ripped some poor guy off terribly. When stuff like that is eliminated, the hobby as a whole is better for it.

These guys are what's truly wrong with the hobby. I hate when people rip off unsuspecting collectors. Some of these "ballhawks" sound a bit like sociopaths. Have they no empathy for the guy who caught the ball?

Pujols may be on top of the world because of his signing. But he's going to need to prove that he can hit outside of the Cards' lineup and in a new league. I'll bet he's up to the task, but how many fans treat you as well as your first city?

[xpress34]

Fans always act like these players should play for less than their value because
they make millions and if it weren't for the fans..blah blah blah

As Andrew noted Pujols has been one of the most underpaid players for
years. Good for him for getting his worth and in my opinion, and then
some to make up for those underpaid years!

And for those always complaining about the plight of their small market
teams...be thankful for revenue sharing or else there probably wouldn't
even be a team in your small market city. In my opinion MLB is watered down
with all these teams and would be better off without some of these teams anyways...
Pujols Angels products selling out means money for everyone!

I just hope the Cards fans appreciate Pujols for what he did.

Goh -

1st, you know I respect you so I'm sure you will take this in the vein it is intended...

As far as Gingi's comments (and Gingi - you know I respect you too!) - I will tell you without a doubt - strike or not -the fans DO pay the players salaries. Why do ticket prices go up? To pay for larger payrolls. Why do food prices go up? To pay for larger salaries. Even after LOSING seasons ticket prices go up.

IF the fans of the game could give up their fix (going to the games - buying gear, etc) in unison for even one day - it would make a HUGE dent in the owner's pockets. And if you think the owner's are paying the players out of their 'love for the game', you have another think coming.

The way the system is set up now - in pretty much any sport - is to take as much from the fans as possible and give as little as is possible back. The FANS pay for the stadiums (taxes) yet the OWNERS collect all the revenue? When is the last time an OWNER invested his OWN money into building a new stadium? They would rather threaten moving the team than putting their own money out there... why? Because the FANS will pay it. As fans, do we really get anything back from our investment in the game? Do the owners and players share any profits from a good season by cutting ticket prices, etc? NO - instead they RAISE the prices again.

If the fans only watched the games on TV, the salaries would have to fall as the TV revenues don't cover all the payroll and such...

Speaking of Stadiums - sorry for the segue - The Marlins, Jeffrey L and many Politicos in Miami might be in some hot water with the SEC depending on their findings. How did the bonds (that are tax payer backed) to build the stadium get approved without a vote of the people to approve those bonds and tax increases? Part of the SEC investigation includes looking into what Politicos Jeffrey L and the Marlins contributed to during the most recent elections before the bonds were miraculously approved.

Now, as far as the small market teams - I have to disagree with you Goh. If teams start getting redacted (to beef it back up - you called it watered down) I believe it would get boring real quick when there are only so many teams to watch. Also, as Moneyball has shown, you would also miss out on the potential opportunity for many players to ever even get signed - much less get a shot at the majors. Hell, Pujols wasn't drafted until the 13th round and was the 18th pick in that round to boot.

If you redacted clubs, the draft would shrink as well and guys like Pujols and others might not ever get the chance to show what they have in the Minors - much less on the big stage.

As far as my issue with Pujols - don't claim to want to be with a team forever AND say it's not about the money - and then run for the no-trade contract (which is a non issue anyway as Pujols is a 10-5 guy) with crap tons of money and act like the Cardinals beat you down to take what they offered in the past and act spurned they didn't offer more this time.

He's on the backside of his career and St Louis made him the face of the franchise his second year after winning the ROY which gave him every opportunity to get his charity going (I applaud him for that) as well as market himself as THE guy - not just in St Louis, but a large portion of the mid-west.

As far as the claims of others that we would all leave for the money - I wouldn't LIE about it. Also, I can't say I would absolutely leave for it - some things at my current job are intangibles that I might not get in another position, regardless of the money involved.

And to Frik - Tulo is a guy who told the Rockies and Denver that this is where he wanted to be and signed his deal last year - locking him up until 2020 - at an avg of $15m a year. That contract could be a steal for the Rox AND Tulo is arguably THE guy on the Rockies and he is the ONLY one who stops regularly out back and signs for all the fans. I heard Pujols quit doing that a long time ago and when the Cards have been here in Denver, he hasn't exactly been 'warm' to the fans - even the ones that come from St Louis to watch the team.

Sorry for the rant, but I have a hard time feeling all warm and fuzzy for a guy that says one thing in public and then does another.

I am just wondering if he will even give the Cardinal fans the courtesy of a farewell speech via TV, the Internet or whatever. I do believe he owes the fans that much at lest for all of their support.

[frikativ54]

I am just wondering if he will even give the Cardinal fans the courtesy of a farewell speech via TV, the Internet or whatever. I do believe he owes the fans that much at lest for all of their support.

Here's what some in St. Louis have to say about Pujols:

http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j16/frikativ54/PujolsWheatiesFuel.jpg

I hope Pujols gets what he deserves for his act in St. Louis at the WS parade.

[worldchamps]

In 2011
Rangers were 40-17 vs AL West

56-49 vs everyone else

2013 we add the Astros to the division, so even more wins but so do the angels, oh well. Just hoping this means more chances of getting Pujols autographs.

[gnishiyama]

Xpress
You may have misinterpreted when I said


Fans always act like these players should play for less than their value because
they make millions and if it weren't for the fans..blah blah blahthat I don't realize we pay the players' salaries. Of course I do. The thing is
I don't care. When prices go up, I spend less or go to less games. I make
adjustments in my life rather than complaining. (not saying you are)
Was I particularly happy that a small portion of my tax dollars went towards
the new Yankee Stadium? Of course not. However all was forgotten when
I first visited the new stadium and saw how great it was! I can give
you a million other things I hate seeing my hard earned tax money
being spent on than to building a new stadium. Corruption, War...

Bottom line is sports brings to my life a lot of enjoyment and I don't focus
on things that I can't control like prices and player salaries. If you want to
go and make a stand against the owners go ahead, it's not for me.

Back to Pujols; good for him that he ultimately did what he thought was
best for him no matter the reason. This is a business and it was his decision
to make. He doesn't owe anything except thanking the Cards fan for their
support through the years, which I expect him to do, just as Cards fan
should be thankful they got to witness 11 (prime) years of arguably the
best hitter in history.

As Jeff said the Cardinals will be just fine without him. Even as a Yankees
fan I see that team has something special and they have passionate fans
to go along with it.


I hope Pujols gets what he deserves for his act in St. Louis at the WS parade.Frikativ: Why do you always sound so bitter in your posts? What exactly
does Pujols deserve for helping his team win another WS title?

Anyway happy holidays guys. Can't wait for baseball to start!

[gameused]

Great signing for the Angels. I had a feeling that when Tony Larussa retired Pujols would sign elsewhere and with an American league team, he can stiil play first base and DH or just DH, which in the long run will prolong his career.

Can't wait to see him play in person on the West coast.

Thanks,
Bobby

[geoff]

I was shocked and when I thought about it I think its a good move so he can get that full no trade clause and DH sometimes and 5 or 6 years from now be a DH mostly.

[vonbrandingo]

Welcome to California, Albert! I think you'll enjoy the weather compared to MO. Bring your winter coat though, you'll need it batting in your new lineup.

[emann]

As fans, do we really get anything back from our investment in the game?

We get entertainment.

Same thing we get from watching a movie starring people who are paid millions of dollars to pretend they're somebody else for two hours. It isn't fair in terms of salaries, but that is one of the top things people spend money on, so their income reflects that.

Sports has the added element of competition for fans of a certain area and emotional history attached to it for most. So, it becomes more than entertainment...

I was a lifelong baseball fan, but in 1994, I was appalled by the strike killing the World Series. I felt the players were beyond greedy, the owners were corrupt and the game was ruined. I didn't watch baseball AT ALL again until about 2003 (and didn't set foot in a park again until 2009). For that entire time, they lost my yearly expense of a few hundred dollars in tickets, merch sales, food sales, etc. It didn't kill the game, but I didn't feel I wanted to support this system anymore. I was getting nothing in return except anger and frustration.

What happened though was after that I came back to baseball, I enjoy for what it's worth as entertainment and am a bigger fan than I was before. It's a great way to escape the politics and issues of "normal" life. I look at things like the Pujols contract and laugh at how out of touch and absurd this stuff is... I'm surprised more things like this don't show up:

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/974034-james-loney-dodgers-star-crashes-maserati-and-goes-completely-crazy

Not to sound too preachy, but I highly recommend taking time away from sports if the enjoyment factor gets lost. It's not supposed to be work for fans, it's supposed to be an escape from the grind. That's why they pay the guy who hits the little ball with a stick the big dollars, it's HIS problem if he misses it, not mine (I just get to boo him).

[xpress34]

We get entertainment.

Same thing we get from watching a movie starring people who are paid millions of dollars to pretend they're somebody else for two hours. It isn't fair in terms of salaries, but that is one of the top things people spend money on, so their income reflects that.

e -

I've heard that argument before. My only issue with it - my tax dollars aren't paying for the movie theater where I go to watch the movies while the movie theater keeps all the profits.

If the people in a city pay higher taxes to build a stadium for a team, I feel the city and it's people should benefit more than just the tax revenue from ticket/food/concessions sales. Just my .02.

[allstarsplus]

This is a conglomeration of info I dug up on the Cardinals owners. Combined ownership group is worth reportedly over $5 billion and that could be low.

The Dewitt's are shrewd 'businesspeople'. When their group bought the Cardinals one of the aspects they liked in the deal was all the real estate holdings that came along with the team purchase and the first order of business would be a real estate 'flip' that would almost give them the franchise + the stadium for FREE. The owners bought the team in 1995 for $150 million. The purchase price included the stadium (Old Busch), adjacent parking garages and various parcels of downtown land. The parking garages and some of the land were sold for $101 million, giving them a baseball team at a net cost of $49 million. They have since built the new stadium for approximately $350 million of which they received millions in tax incentive and millions in publicly funded infrastructure cost. The true price of what the Cardinals owners put into the new stadium is unknown and after the 2013 season it appears they have clear ownership of the stadium with only privately held obligations.

The Dewitt's and partners accumulated much of their wealth in a bank flip. In a Sept. 3, 2004 St. Louis Post-Dispatch interview with Andrew Baur, it was said that Baur and Dewitt's family and other team owners were stockholders in Mississippi Valley Bancshares, which owned Southwest Bank in St. Louis. The bank was bought for $9.4 million in 1984 and was sold a few years ago for $502 million. In addition to Baur, Cardinal owners Fred Hanser and Donna DeWitt Lambert (sister of William DeWitt) were large stockholders in the company.

Despite their wealth, the Cardinals' owners are not known for being generous. In 1997, the Cardinals fired the stadium's janitorial team after they refused to accept a wage cut. The Cardinals' management wanted to cut their pay from $9.70 an hour to $6.90 an hour. Some of the janitors worked for the Cardinals for more than 20 years. Eventually, an agreement was reached with the workers' union. This is how the agreement was reported in the April 20, 1997 edition of the Post:

"The new agreement means the workers with the most seniority will take a pay cut of 50 cents an hour while all union members will lose health benefits they had under the previous contract."

The Cardinals seem to be crying poor and the anger is pointed towards Pujols. Its just good to know a little bit of the other side of the story about Dewitt and partners.

[frikativ54]

The Cardinals seem to be crying poor and the anger is pointed towards Pujols. Its just good to know a little bit of the other side of the story about Dewitt and partners.

Thank you for all this information. I don't have that much background on the Cardinals owners, but it is definitely food for thought. I appreciate your posting it, because it gives me another perspective. :)

-Frik

[allstarsplus]

Thank you for all this information. I don't have that much background on the Cardinals owners, but it is definitely food for thought. I appreciate your posting it, because it gives me another perspective. :)

-Frik

You are welcome. I am usually one that will side with ownership and bash the player for being greedy. I just think there is way more behind the scenes in this case. Some have said it is like LeBron and I really don't think it is the same. We will probably never know the real truth as this will take some time to see what leaks out.

I commend Albert for signing a contract years ago with the Cardinals and playing out the terms of the contract. He never publicly threatened or said he would hold out on his 8 year deal that paid him $111 mill. In his case, he far exceeded in relative value what he was being paid (approx $13.8 million per season).

I watched on ESPN a woman burning her Pujols jersey----there is a lot of anger. Yes, Albert left and could have stayed for less money and it is so much money that he couldn't spend it all in his lifetime which is why I don't think it is all about the money.

[Birdbats]

It's funny how people can look at the same numbers and come up with different interpretations. For example, while the Cardinals ownership group might be worth $5 billion, you need to know there are many members of that ownership group (maybe 15?). Some of those members have massive assets, but only a small slice of the team. So, for example, if someone has $500M in assets but owns 2% of the team, that person's assets are pretty much irrelevant to the question of what the team can afford.

Also, the owners anted up a much larger percentage of the stadium cost than is typical for most team owners. I believe something like $45 million came from the public and the other $320 came from the team and bonds to be paid by the team over a couple decades. Only the SF Giants' stadium had a larger percentage of private financing than Busch.

Are the Cards' owners rich? Absolutely. Did they make a great purchase, flip properties and get an even better deal? Oh, yeah. Are they stingy? That's debatable. Are they crying poor? Absolutely not.

I think the ownership would have happily made Pujols the highest paid player in baseball (AAV) if he'd accepted a 5-6 year contract (at maybe $28-30M/yr). But, when Albert's agent demanded 10 years, the team seems to have decided (wisely, in my opinion) that was a poor investment, long term. I think that was a solid business decision and a smart baseball decision -- regardless of how much money the team's owners have on paper.

[freddiefreeman5]

It amazes me how Cardinal fans on TV and the internet are calling him greedy.
He played for half his worth and never complained. The owners enjoyed the best player in baseball for a bargain price.
In a world of players holding teams hostage Pujols was a breath of fresh air. He signed a contract and he honored it.

[allstarsplus]

Are the Cards' owners rich? Absolutely. Did they make a great purchase, flip properties and get an even better deal? Oh, yeah. Are they stingy? That's debatable. Are they crying poor? Absolutely not.

I think the ownership would have happily made Pujols the highest paid player in baseball (AAV) if he'd accepted a 5-6 year contract (at maybe $28-30M/yr). But, when Albert's agent demanded 10 years, the team seems to have decided (wisely, in my opinion) that was a poor investment, long term. I think that was a solid business decision and a smart baseball decision -- regardless of how much money the team's owners have on paper.


Jeff, you and I shared some good times in St. Louis and I known your passion for the team and it is good to hear your opinion.

The crying poor comment was how they portrayed their team and city as a smaller market and their constraints on spending. I dont buy it. The market is what you create. ST Louis attendance is robust, advertising is evident, TV rights are owned by the team.

Their basis in the team vs it's market value makes their ownership a tremendous net value in the $100's of millions! It's like buying a home that you knew the land could be subdivided and even though you paid $1.5 million you sold the adjoining lot for $1 million so you have $500,000 investment into it. Ten years later you tear the home down and rebuild it. The market values have skyrocketed and now it is worth $7 million against a total investment of $4. You rent the home out now and on top of the positive cash flow the mortgage and all debt will be paid off in 7 years.

[slambam]

It amazes me how Cardinal fans on TV and the internet are calling him greedy.
He played for half his worth and never complained. The owners enjoyed the best player in baseball for a bargain price.
In a world of players holding teams hostage Pujols was a breath of fresh air. He signed a contract and he honored it.

The fact that he's always said he wanted to stay in St Louis is what gets to the Cardinal fans. I've heard multiple places that the Cards last offer was 9 yr/$210 mil + a performance based option for a 10th yr and Mo even said that this may not have even been there strongest offer, but Albert and his agent didn't go back to the Cards after they got the Angles offer - they just took it and ran. Plus, throw in the higher tax rate and cost of living in LA, and Albert really isn't making that much more than he would have had in St Louis. THAT is more of a reason why Cardinals fans are pissed. It's nothing less than a kick in the junk and spit in the face to the franchise and the fans.

[halofan]

Frustrated by Cards

Los Angeles Dodgers manager Don Mattingly participated in Pujols' charity tournament Saturday. They had become friends over the years and Mattingly sensed something was awry in Pujols' relationship with the Cardinals' front office.
"There was a frustration there," said Mattingly, who grew up a Cardinals' fan in Evansville, Ind. "You could just sense something was wrong. He was getting frustrated by it.
"I hoped he would stay in St. Louis because he's such a legend there. He's like [Derek] Jeter and Cal [Ripken], but I also knew he would go where his heart would take him. People talk about the money, but I knew he would be following his heart."
Pujols' frustration stemmed from two years of not being able to come to an agreement with the Cardinals on a long-term contract extension and sensing the team didn't view him as a priority. He helped the team to the World Series championship this season in the final year of an eight-year, $116 million deal.
They made an offer in February worth about $195 million for nine years. Pujols, who wanted a 10-year deal, declined. They agreed to shut down negotiations until the season ended, but when free agency opened on Oct. 30, the Cardinals took the offer away and supplemented it with much shorter-term deals. Pujols, people said, almost felt as if the team was daring him to leave.


You can read the rest of article here

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/baseball/al/angels/story/2011-12-08/albert-pujols-cj-wilson-sign/51750952/1?loc=interstitialskip

Pujols turned down Marlins $275M, All because he wanted a no-trade clause. Pujols signed for less money to play for Angels. If, Cardinals fans are going to be mad, be mad at the GM & Cardinals front office.

Comes down to one word "Respect" and Pujols felt he didn't get that from the Cardinals front office. They dared him to leave and he did.

[freddiefreeman5]

The fact that he's always said he wanted to stay in St Louis is what gets to the Cardinal fans. I've heard multiple places that the Cards last offer was 9 yr/$210 mil + a performance based option for a 10th yr and Mo even said that this may not have even been there strongest offer, but Albert and his agent didn't go back to the Cards after they got the Angles offer - they just took it and ran. Plus, throw in the higher tax rate and cost of living in LA, and Albert really isn't making that much more than he would have had in St Louis. THAT is more of a reason why Cardinals fans are pissed. It's nothing less than a kick in the junk and spit in the face to the franchise and the fans.
He probably did want to stay in St. Louis. He just couldn't pass up 3 things.
1. A buttload of money
2. The ability to DH later in his career.
3. Not having to see that lying, cheating, cant hit but .260 even with steroids, McGwire in the dugout every game.

[freddiefreeman5]

Like I said, the cards enjoyed one of the best bargains in baseball for many years. They have no reason to complain.

[allstarsplus]

He probably did want to stay in St. Louis. He just couldn't pass up 3 things.

3. Not having to see that lying, cheating, cant hit but .260 even with steroids, McGwire in the dugout every game.

Do you have a reason why you said that about "Not having to see....McGwire in the dugout every game?

I have been on the field twice in the last 2 years with Mac and Pujols in a closed stadium while nobody was really looking so they didn't have to put on an act. I saw 2 buddies with mutual respect.

In this photo below, it was Pujols grabbing McGwire and gave him a bear hug and lifted him off of the ground:

50426

In this photo, I think Pujols was tickling McGwire.

50427

[Bondsgloves]

Looks like Canseco wasn't the only one sticking it in McGwires Butt.:rolleyes:

[freddiefreeman5]

Do you have a reason why you said that about "Not having to see....McGwire in the dugout every game?


Just my opinion. I know i wouldn't want to be around McGwire on a regular bases. He is the face of what we teach little leaguers not to be.

Why?

[allstarsplus]

Just my opinion. I know i wouldn't want to be around McGwire on a regular bases. He is the face of what we teach little leaguers not to be.

Why?

Mark and I have talked a lot. My favorite talk was about how the HR chase got young kids to love baseball. Now he speaks out about PEDs.

I don't condone cheating and it sickens me but Mark apologized. Everyone can make their own decisions.

I think Mac is in the Top 3 hitting coaches in the Majors. His knowledge and preperation is top notch.

[freddiefreeman5]

Well, thats your opinion.

[emann]

Looks like Canseco wasn't the only one sticking it in McGwires Butt.:rolleyes:

I lol'd at this. :eek:

[allstarsplus]

This is another point-of-view:

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-500188_162-57340808/cards-never-intended-to-sign-pujols-writer/

[70to66]

"Do I want to be in St.Louis forever? Of course. People from other teams want to play

in St. Louis, and they're jealous that we're in St. Louis

because the fans are unbelievable. So why would you want to

leave a place like St. Louis to go somewhere else and make $3

million or $4 more million a year? It's not about the money. I

already got my money. It's about winning, and that's it."



-albert pujols 2009

[SaintsGeaux]

"Do I want to be in St.Louis forever? Of course. People from other teams want to play

in St. Louis, and they're jealous that we're in St. Louis

because the fans are unbelievable. So why would you want to

leave a place like St. Louis to go somewhere else and make $3

million or $4 more million a year? It's not about the money. I

already got my money. It's about winning, and that's it."



-albert pujols 2009

Albert said those words 2 years ago. Things change and can change quickly. Kim Kardashian said sacred words in marriage vows a few months ago. Presidents give the Nation promises that they don't fulfill. Some of you need to get over it. Not sure what you all want with Albert.

[freddiefreeman5]

When the golden goose is lost people tend to panic.

[70to66]

I'm fine with him leaving, I did NOT want the Cardinals to give him that kind of contract for that long. Look at the Arod deal. We got the best ten/eleven years of his career. The only thing I'm going to miss is that he will hit his
500th home run with another team. Time will tell on this contract and it will probably be better for him to be able to be a DH in the later years of the contract to help further his career. I wish him well, I was a Cardinal fan before he was a Cardinal and I am still one now he is gone. Most players don't spend their careers with one team and they all eventually retire.

[freddiefreeman5]

I'm fine with him leaving, I did NOT want the Cardinals to give him that kind of contract for that long. Look at the Arod deal. We got the best ten/eleven years of his career. The only thing I'm going to miss is that he will hit his
500th home run with another team. Time will tell on this contract and it will probably be better for him to be able to be a DH in the later years of the contract to help further his career. I wish him well, I was a Cardinal fan before he was a Cardinal and I am still one now he is gone. Most players don't spend their careers with one team and they all eventually retire.
That was so refreshing.

[70to66]

That's what I said when we won the World Series this year, glad you liked it!

[gingi79]

I'm fine with him leaving, I did NOT want the Cardinals to give him that kind of contract for that long. Look at the Arod deal. We got the best ten/eleven years of his career. The only thing I'm going to miss is that he will hit his 500th home run with another team. Time will tell on this contract and it will probably be better for him to be able to be a DH in the later years of the contract to help further his career. I wish him well, I was a Cardinal fan before he was a Cardinal and I am still one now he is gone. Most players don't spend their careers with one team and they all eventually retire.

I'd love to say I'd be this poised if my favorite player left my favorite team but I'm much to petty and easily incited to believe that. I'm more Cleveland Cavs than St Louis Cards when it comes to my fandom but I digress. I'm glad to see the Cardinals and their fans are still as classy as ever.

Three opinionated thoughts:

1) I think this really cements Stan Musial as THE Cardinal to future generations as well as past.

2) I don't think Albert Pujols will wear an Angels hat in his HOF plaque, 500th HR notwithstanding.

3) Pujols won't finish this contract, by his decision and one day retires a Cardinal.

[lakeerie92]

I'd love to say I'd be this poised if my favorite player left my favorite team but I'm much to petty and easily incited to believe that. I'm more Cleveland Cavs than St Louis Cards when it comes to my fandom but I digress. I'm glad to see the Cardinals and their fans are still as classy as ever.

Three opinionated thoughts:

1) I think this really cements Stan Musial as THE Cardinal to future generations as well as past.

2) I don't think Albert Pujols will wear an Angels hat in his HOF plaque, 500th HR notwithstanding.

3) Pujols won't finish this contract, by his decision and one day retires a Cardinal.

I love Chipper, but at times I wish he would go to a AL team and DH for another 3 or 4 years to get 3000 hits and 500 HRs

[freddiefreeman5]

It was a little bit harder to leave your team when Musial played. ;)

[gingi79]

I love Chipper, but at times I wish he would go to a AL team and DH for another 3 or 4 years to get 3000 hits and 500 HRs

A very interesting idea. As long as it wasn't the Yankees.....I don't think I could take that.

Maybe instead of Dale Murphy being the one Braves fans now believe is should be in the HOF because of Ron Santo, wouldn't Chipper be a better comparison?

[70to66]

Albert has been the face of the franchise most of his career, he has never been my favorite Cardinal. I usually like the scrappy players like Vina & Eckstein and Wainwright is my favorite current player. Albert has done a lot thru his giving side helping kids with down syndrome and I hate to see that side of him go. Like I said before I wish him and his family the best and at the end of the day realize its a business.

[OaklandAsFan]

It was a little bit harder to leave your team when Musial played. ;)

exactly, I love hearing people talk about how players stayed with their team their whole careers back in the day. THEY HAD NO CHOICE!!! They were basically slaves.

[onlyalbert]

exactly, I love hearing people talk about how players stayed with their team their whole careers back in the day. THEY HAD NO CHOICE!!! They were basically slaves.

That's why it is so much more important for a player today to do it. If Jordan could do it over do you think he would be a Wizard? Not only will he never be Musial he will never be Ripken, Jeter, Rivera, Tulo, Mauer etc. I think the thing that hurts the most is, being a traditionalist, I wanted to see what his numbers would've been with only one team in the end. Also, we have to now watch him get 3,000 maybe 4,000 and 500, 600, maybe 700 in another uniform. Cards fans feel cheated and his comments about wanting to be on a winning team with winning teamates and it not being about money and God will lead him in the right direction.....c'mon!

[OaklandAsFan]

hey at least the uniforms are both red and white :)

[Birdbats]

The crying poor comment was how they portrayed their team and city as a smaller market and their constraints on spending. I dont buy it. The market is what you create. ST Louis attendance is robust, advertising is evident, TV rights are owned by the team.

I'm sure it looks good on the outside, but this is a small market team. Yes, we fill the stadium, but you'd probably be shocked to know how many of those tickets are discounted or even free. Ad revenues and TV revenues also are small potatoes compared to markets on the coast (just look at that deal the Angels have, which makes the Pujols signing possible). There are revenues from concessions, but little from parking. As you know, merchandising is put into the MLB pot and split 30 ways, and post-season revenues aren't all that great because teams don't get squat unless the series goes beyond the minimum number of games. I'm sure the Cardinals are profitable, but they're not printing money.

And yes, the franchise is worth much more today than it was in '96. But, that's an unrealized capital gain. If the Cardinals gave Pujols a contract leveraged against the team's value, it would be the first franchise in history to base a contract on it's balance sheet instead of its P&L. I don't think there's any way Pujols gets the Angels offer without their new TV deal in place, or he gets the Marlin's offer without the new stadium.

We know this morning that the Cards first offer to Pujols after the season was five years at $26M per. I'm confident that could have been negotiated up to make Albert the highest paid player on an AAV basis. I assume the Cardinals were thinking, "Let's make him the highest-paid player, which is what he deserves, for what should be his last five productive years as a position player; then when he's 37, either negotiate a new deal that works for both sides or let him finish his career in the AL as a DH." If that's the case, I can't say I would have done anything differently. He should be the highest paid, but he shouldn't be making top dollar at 37. I'm firmly on the team's side.

At the same time, I don't blame Albert at all. When I was 31, I was invincible. I'd guess someone with his skills is many times more confident than I was. He probably thinks that he's different, that because he's so great, time won't catch up with him like it did everyone else (who wasn't juiced). He's not thinking like a team owner, who understands Albert's production in his late 30s wouldn't justify the salary and would handcuff the team. He's thinking like a young man with an ego and the ability to hit a baseball like few ever have. Presented with five years at $28 per or 10 years at $25.4 per, I'm sure when I was 31 that I'd be on my way to Anaheim, too. So, I can't call him selfish -- especially knowing how much of his salary will be used to help others. I'll simply acknowledge that, as mature as Albert seems at times, he can't help but think like a 31-year-old.

We won't know for years how this actually will work out. But, I have to wonder if, someday, when he's older and wiser and reflecting back on the past week, Albert might have regrets about not staying in St. Louis five more years as the highest paid player in history.

[OaklandAsFan]

Pujols should be the highest paid player no doubt but his contract should have been structured opposite the way most of them are these days. He should have had his highest paid years NOW and have the yearly value go down as the years went by so when he is a 42 year old shell of his former self he wouldn't be paid a ridiculous amount of money that may prevent a team from signing a key piece.

I understand why teams structure them this way, pay him little now and when it gets too expensive unload him to another team but with a NTC and a 10 year personal services contract for when he retires, realistically this would have been the best way to go.

[camarokids]

When the Cardinal fans get over their initial hurt, they will realize this is smart move to let him go. He is not worth a ten year contract. This will be a bad move for the LAA of Anaheim Orange County California ;)...... Anything short of a World Series victory in 2012 will be considered a failure for the Angels and Pujols!

Who was the hero of the 2011 World Series? A young man named David Freese! Who got the clutch hits that won the WS? David Freese!

What did Pujols do in the 2011 World Series? He hit 3 Home runs in a lopsided win when the pressure was off to produce.

Albert is good, but not that good!

2004 WS 5 for 15 with a .333 BA no HR's and no RBI's
2006 WS 3 for 15 with a .200 BA 1 HR and 2 RBI's
2011 WS 6 for 24 with a .240 BA 3 HR's and 6 RBI's (all HR & RBI came in one game)

Hardly impressive stats in the World Series for one, who is being called the best player/hitter ever.....:confused:

[Manram]

When the Cardinal fans get over their initial hurt, they will realize this is smart move to let him go. He is not worth a ten year contract. This will be a bad move for the LAA of Anaheim Orange County California ;)...... Anything short of a World Series victory in 2012 will be considered a failure for the Angels and Pujols!

Who was the hero of the 2011 World Series? A young man named David Freese! Who got the clutch hits that won the WS? David Freese!

What did Pujols do in the 2011 World Series? He hit 3 Home runs in a lopsided win when the pressure was off to produce.

Albert is good, but not that good!

2004 WS 5 for 15 with a .333 BA no HR's and no RBI's
2006 WS 3 for 15 with a .200 BA 1 HR and 2 RBI's
2011 WS 6 for 24 with a .240 BA 3 HR's and 6 RBI's (all HR & RBI came in one game)

Hardly impressive stats in the World Series for one, who is being called the best player/hitter ever.....:confused:

All you are talking about is the postseason, which although it is important look at his regular season stats! Also last year in the world series look at what the people hitting behind pujols did. Holliday did terrible...... his stats could be easily because teams had no problem walking him and he may have chased pitches and what not.

[OaklandAsFan]

When the Cardinal fans get over their initial hurt, they will realize this is smart move to let him go. He is not worth a ten year contract. This will be a bad move for the LAA of Anaheim Orange County California ;)...... Anything short of a World Series victory in 2012 will be considered a failure for the Angels and Pujols!

Who was the hero of the 2011 World Series? A young man named David Freese! Who got the clutch hits that won the WS? David Freese!

What did Pujols do in the 2011 World Series? He hit 3 Home runs in a lopsided win when the pressure was off to produce.

Albert is good, but not that good!

2004 WS 5 for 15 with a .333 BA no HR's and no RBI's
2006 WS 3 for 15 with a .200 BA 1 HR and 2 RBI's
2011 WS 6 for 24 with a .240 BA 3 HR's and 6 RBI's (all HR & RBI came in one game)

Hardly impressive stats in the World Series for one, who is being called the best player/hitter ever.....:confused:

You can't say Pujols had nothing to do with it. Pujols caused issues just because he is Pujols. I'm a firm believer that if Wash had chosen to pitch to Albert in game 6 the Rangers would have been home celebrating a championship instead of playing game 7. Instead because he is Albert and Wash stated he wasn't going to let Albert beat him, so no matter the fact that Albert hadn't done squat he walked him to pitch to Berkman who had been on fire and hits better from the left side of the plate.
Yes Freese was the hero but without the aura of Albert he wouldn't have had the chance to do what he did in game 6 and 7.

[sox83cubs84]

Street souvenir vendors outside Wrigley Field aren't going to be happy about Pujols leaving, either. Now they're stuck with a supply of very politically incorrect "Pujols Mows My Lawn" t-shirts.:p

Dave Miedema

[onlyalbert]

I'm sure it looks good on the outside, but this is a small market team. Yes, we fill the stadium, but you'd probably be shocked to know how many of those tickets are discounted or even free. Ad revenues and TV revenues also are small potatoes compared to markets on the coast (just look at that deal the Angels have, which makes the Pujols signing possible). There are revenues from concessions, but little from parking. As you know, merchandising is put into the MLB pot and split 30 ways, and post-season revenues aren't all that great because teams don't get squat unless the series goes beyond the minimum number of games. I'm sure the Cardinals are profitable, but they're not printing money.

And yes, the franchise is worth much more today than it was in '96. But, that's an unrealized capital gain. If the Cardinals gave Pujols a contract leveraged against the team's value, it would be the first franchise in history to base a contract on it's balance sheet instead of its P&L. I don't think there's any way Pujols gets the Angels offer without their new TV deal in place, or he gets the Marlin's offer without the new stadium.

We know this morning that the Cards first offer to Pujols after the season was five years at $26M per. I'm confident that could have been negotiated up to make Albert the highest paid player on an AAV basis. I assume the Cardinals were thinking, "Let's make him the highest-paid player, which is what he deserves, for what should be his last five productive years as a position player; then when he's 37, either negotiate a new deal that works for both sides or let him finish his career in the AL as a DH." If that's the case, I can't say I would have done anything differently. He should be the highest paid, but he shouldn't be making top dollar at 37. I'm firmly on the team's side.

At the same time, I don't blame Albert at all. When I was 31, I was invincible. I'd guess someone with his skills is many times more confident than I was. He probably thinks that he's different, that because he's so great, time won't catch up with him like it did everyone else (who wasn't juiced). He's not thinking like a team owner, who understands Albert's production in his late 30s wouldn't justify the salary and would handcuff the team. He's thinking like a young man with an ego and the ability to hit a baseball like few ever have. Presented with five years at $28 per or 10 years at $25.4 per, I'm sure when I was 31 that I'd be on my way to Anaheim, too. So, I can't call him selfish -- especially knowing how much of his salary will be used to help others. I'll simply acknowledge that, as mature as Albert seems at times, he can't help but think like a 31-year-old.

We won't know for years how this actually will work out. But, I have to wonder if, someday, when he's older and wiser and reflecting back on the past week, Albert might have regrets about not staying in St. Louis five more years as the highest paid player in history.


Hey Jeff, this marks the end of an era in St.L. Does it also mark the end of the Pujols bat chart?

[camarokids]

You can't say Pujols had nothing to do with it. Pujols caused issues just because he is Pujols. I'm a firm believer that if Wash had chosen to pitch to Albert in game 6 the Rangers would have been home celebrating a championship instead of playing game 7. Instead because he is Albert and Wash stated he wasn't going to let Albert beat him, so no matter the fact that Albert hadn't done squat he walked him to pitch to Berkman who had been on fire and hits better from the left side of the plate.
Yes Freese was the hero but without the aura of Albert he wouldn't have had the chance to do what he did in game 6 and 7.

I do agree. The opposing teams should have pitched to him instead of trying to think too much. Which usually ends up backfiring.

[Birdbats]

Hey Jeff, this marks the end of an era in St.L. Does it also mark the end of the Pujols bat chart?

Yes, it does. I'm a Cardinals collector and I run my site for other Cardinals collectors. I tracked Pujols because he was the focus of so many Cardinals collectors. I admittedly don't know much about McGwire's Oakland bats because my focus is his Cardinals stuff; same will go for Pujols.

Now that he's an Angel, maybe an Angels fan will take up the challenge. Even if I wanted to continue tracking Pujols, I'd have access to very few games. Sure, I could subscribe online, but I have zero interest in watching Angels games just to see what Pujols is using.

In a way, it's almost a relief. The Cardinals-era book now has a beginning, middle and end. If Pujols starts using purple B45 bats with green handle tape and hot pink tar next year, someone else can document it. I'll keep researching everything I can about his finite career in St. Louis.

[rj_lucas]

In my opinion, this piece by Bryan Burwell comes closer to hitting the nail on the head than anything else I've read:

http://www.stltoday.com/sports/columns/bryan-burwell/burwell-pujols-charmed-by-angels/article_824c2458-7d00-56ad-8f8a-e969832611af.html

Generations from now, when people look back at this, there's only one question they'll ask:

How could the Cardinals have ever allowed Albert Pujols to reach free agency?

Everything else is just noise.

[woodbat]

Yes, it does. I'm a Cardinals collector and I run my site for other Cardinals collectors. I tracked Pujols because he was the focus of so many Cardinals collectors. I admittedly don't know much about McGwire's Oakland bats because my focus is his Cardinals stuff; same will go for Pujols.

Now that he's an Angel, maybe an Angels fan will take up the challenge. Even if I wanted to continue tracking Pujols, I'd have access to very few games. Sure, I could subscribe online, but I have zero interest in watching Angels games just to see what Pujols is using.

In a way, it's almost a relief. The Cardinals-era book now has a beginning, middle and end. If Pujols starts using purple B45 bats with green handle tape and hot pink tar next year, someone else can document it. I'll keep researching everything I can about his finite career in St. Louis.

AMEN!!!!

[allstarsplus]

In my opinion, this piece by Bryan Burwell comes closer to hitting the nail on the head than anything else I've read:

http://www.stltoday.com/sports/columns/bryan-burwell/burwell-pujols-charmed-by-angels/article_824c2458-7d00-56ad-8f8a-e969832611af.html

Generations from now, when people look back at this, there's only one question they'll ask:

How could the Cardinals have ever allowed Albert Pujols to reach free agency?

Everything else is just noise.



In the beginning, both Albert and Dee Dee were a little skeptical of Moreno's charming ways. "I think anyone is going to be great when they're trying to get you to come to their organization," said Dee Dee Pujols. "But in the short time we've known Arte, he's a great guy. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to know when someone is genuine."

That is an interesting last sentence especially after all the stories about Pujols' agent Dan Lozano came out on Deadspin.

[frikativ54]

In the beginning, both Albert and Dee Dee were a little skeptical of Moreno's charming ways. "I think anyone is going to be great when they're trying to get you to come to their organization," said Dee Dee Pujols. "But in the short time we've known Arte, he's a great guy. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to know when someone is genuine."

That is an interesting last sentence especially after all the stories about Pujols' agent Dan Lozano came out on Deadspin.

This is a very good point; I'm not sure just how good of a judge of character Pujols is. The whole thing with the Angels sounds like an elaborate marketing pitch, comparable with the best in the business.

On a totally different note, I've heard rumors that Albert Pujols may be a little older than he says, like 34. If the Cards had any such knowledge, perhaps that's part of why they wouldn't agree to such a long-term deal.

[onlyalbert]

http://www.cnn.com/2011/12/09/opinion/pearlman-pujols/index.html

Above is another interesting article. I was as big a fan as the next guy. Someone told me once you may not want to meet your most favored player....they might disappoint you. Well, I met him twice at the Cardinals Witner Warmup and this article paints a 100% accurate picture. Can't wait to hear the stories of Angels collectors in the coming seasons.

[Birdbats]

The crying poor comment was how they portrayed their team and city as a smaller market and their constraints on spending. I dont buy it. The market is what you create. ST Louis attendance is robust, advertising is evident, TV rights are owned by the team.

I was just told that the Angels new television deal earns the Angels $100 million more per season than the Cardinals' TV deal earns the Cards (the Cards' deal is for less than $50M, as I understand it). So, the difference in TV contracts could just about cover the Cardinals' entire team payroll.

[rj_lucas]

http://www.cnn.com/2011/12/09/opinion/pearlman-pujols/index.html

Above is another interesting article. I was as big a fan as the next guy. Someone told me once you may not want to meet your most favored player....they might disappoint you. Well, I met him twice at the Cardinals Witner Warmup and this article paints a 100% accurate picture. Can't wait to hear the stories of Angels collectors in the coming seasons.

So...because Albert Pujols did not like signing, he was Bin Laden in a baseball uniform?

Sorry man, not buying it.

[freddiefreeman5]

How quickly the fans turns own their once favorite sons.

[freddiefreeman5]

Teach to me talk on the phone and type at the same time. :D

I meant....How quickly the fans turn on their once favorite sons. :o

[xpress34]

So...because Albert Pujols did not like signing, he was Bin Laden in a baseball uniform?

Sorry man, not buying it.

RJ -

I said it once and I'll say it again - I applaud the man for his charity work, don't get me wrong...

But he treats the fans (at least here in Denver) like they are less than nothing - and I have spent time with him back in 2002 when I worked at Nike. I got to spend like 4-5 hours with him as he shopped the store on his comp and he signed a beautiful ball for me, but since then, he seems to show true disdain for the fans.

Case in point, 2 years ago behind Coors Field - ALL of the players in MLB are aware that for the past 3 years now, Coors Field has not let cabs or limos drive into the parking area, so players either go the front gate, ride the bus, or get out of their cab/limo out back and choose to sign or not as they walk past the autograph seekers.

Pujols had his family with him on the final day of the series and had not one, but two limos waiting out back for him after the game. When he came out, we were told by his 'goon squad' (The Prince couldn't be bothered to address us himself) of security not to talk to him, not to ask for autographs and not to photograph him.

We were assembled in a PUBLIC place - not like we followed him into his hotel (I generally don't go the hotel as a rule myself) or to dinner or something. We are in an area that is maintained by Coors Field to be safe for both the players and the fans and he and his 'entourage' acted like we were trespassing on HIS private property.

It will be interesting to see if he has a Randy Johnson moment once he realizes the cameras are EVERYWHERE in the L.A. area just like NYC and the paparazzi will be all over his every movement out there as he is the biggest thing to hit the L.A. area since Kobe/Shaq and Linehart.

Just my .02

[Birdbats]

How quickly the fans turn on their once favorite sons. :o


We're rooting for laundry! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6WSD6Y2YWj4

[freddiefreeman5]

We're rooting for laundry! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6WSD6Y2YWj4
LOL! :)

[MLB~NUT]

We're rooting for laundry! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6WSD6Y2YWj4


Love yah Jeff, but don't bring Seinfeld into a baseball discussion! -9 points...
:mad: