Pete Rose Phillies 1983 road jersey

[sportscentury]

http://cgi.ebay.com/1983-PETE-ROSE-GAME-USED-JERSEY-SIGNED-PHILLIES-PSA_W0QQitemZ220025995636

Howard and others,

What do you think?

Reid

[sfgiants452]

I also would like to know the same thing. He also is selling some interesting Bonds items.

bonds giants g/u jersey and pants
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=012&item=220025995804&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&rd=1

bonds pirates g/u pants
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=012&item=220024724090&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&rd=1

[stkmtimo]

http://cgi.ebay.com/1983-PETE-ROSE-GAME-USED-JERSEY-SIGNED-PHILLIES-PSA_W0QQitemZ220025995636

Howard and others,

What do you think?

Reid

Reid,
I am by no means an expert on Phillies items, but the Wilson tagging looks good to me based on a quick glance. If it's the real deal, that's a great Rose jersey. I'm sure Howard will know best!

Tim

[LHG39]

Ed Doaln is beyond reproach. Looks very good to me.

[ironmanfan]

I wouldn't go that far...Just the other day some one pointed out a bogus Bowa jersey he was selling.

[hblakewolf]

The Bowa in question is bad-the year tag is a dead giveaway. The 1 should not have a tail, nor should there be a dash between the set and year. Quite a few of the "star" Phillies players jerseys were incorrectly manufactured by Whitey Wilonborg back in 1980-1982. This type of tagging was often used

http://www.eddolan.com/bowa_1981-r.htm

Howard Wolf
hblakewolf@patmedia.net



I wouldn't go that far...Just the other day some one pointed out a bogus Bowa jersey he was selling.

[hblakewolf]

Forum readers-
You don’t often see such a gem as this one! From the limited photos, it appears that not only is this shirt PERFECT, it is also one of the more difficult Phillies knits from the 1980’s to find in this type of original condition.

Let me explain. After the 1983 season, these road blue knits were recycled by the Phillies, first to the Phillies AAA affiliate in Portland, Oregon, the Portland Beavers. The names on back were removed, however, the sleeve patches remained intact. The Beavers never used any type of name on back. They were then used a few seasons later in Bend, Oregon for the Bend Phillies. A generic PHILLIES nameplate was added to the backs. As you can imagine, the shirts were pretty much at the end of their lifecycle after being used for at least 5 seasons.

I currently have 5, all original 1983 Phillies road knits: Schmidt, Carlton, Denny, Maddox and….Pete Rose. The Rose in the current auction is set 1, I have set 2. I have attached a photo, and as you will see, the two Rose’s match PERFECTLY.

As a side note, there is currently a 1984 road Rose being sold as a "1983 World Series jersey". Although tagged 84, it has the 1983 patch. The shirt was intended for Rose to wear in 1984, however, he was not with the team in 1984. Someone changed the sleeve patch, and created this grand story that the Phillies wore 1984 tagged jerseys for the 1983 World Serfes. An unworn, all original 1984 Rose will never demand the type of money as the current 1983 road, or a 1983 home, thus, someone made this jersey up to appear to be a gamer from 1983. I can assure you-the Phillies wore their regular season 1983 home and roads into the post season and World Series in 1983. New shirts were not ordered for post-season play.

This Ebay jersey is a great find for someone-PERIOD!

Howard Wolf
hblakewolf@patmedia.net

1597

1598

1599

1600

[hblakewolf]

As a quick update, I have asked the seller to confirm one detail about the jersey. 1983 was the final season that Wilson used a thick "satin" type material as lining in the neck. You can see in my photos that my Rose has this lining, as it should. The Ebay jersey is correct in all aspects, however, I'm not sure if the lining is correct in the collar. It looks like the lining found in 1984-1986 Phillies road shirts, however, it may appear this way in the photo and is correct.

I will update this post once I receive information from the seller.

Howard Wolf
hblakewolf@patmedia.net

[sammy]

Hi Howard,

I see you retracted your bid on the jersey and left Reid as the high bidder.

Was it because there isn't any thick "satin" type material used as lining in the neck?

[hblakewolf]

Hello Sammy-
You are correct.

Although I initially belived this shirt to be perfect in every aspect, I noticed the possible issue with the lining in the neck and sent the seller an email after my original post here. My initial thinking was that the photo was shot in poor lighting or possibly the flash did not correctly identify the collar material as satin and made it appear to be knit. The seller has since contacted me and indicated that the lining is KNIT not satin.

I have posted photos of my 1983 Rose and also the other 4 1983 roads I currently have in my collection. EVERY 1983 road that I own as well as those I have obtained during my Phillies team purchases have had the blue satin lining in the collar, not knit. The Phillies changed to the knit lining in the collar with their 1984 jerseys. Again, I have had dozens of 1984 roads, and all have knit, not satin. I have never seen a road 1983 Phillies jersey with knit in the collar. As such, I am not comfortable with the shirt and retracted my bid.

What's extremely interesting about the shirt is that all other aspects appear to be good-tagging, NOB, # style, etc.

Howard Wolf
hblakewolf@patmedia.net

[sportscentury]

Hi Howard,

I see you retracted your bid on the jersey and left Reid as the high bidder.

Was it because there isn't any thick "satin" type material used as lining in the neck?


Sammy and Howard,

I asked the seller several times to cancel my bid. He responded only once asking for evidence that the jersey is not good. I sent him the evidence. Now he is back to not responding. I called this morning, as well - no response. I retracted my bid. I don't feel at all comfortable with the jersey and there is only so much a person can do to try to get a seller to respond. The collar is not correct. I'm not sure what this jersey is, but the incorrect collar does explain why the patch and numbers look stiff and new. It's a shame... adding a Rose 83 to one's collection would be a high point for any Rose or Phillies collector, as the Phils won the pennant that year.

Reid

[CollectGU]

Howard,

This is an honest question from me as I was interested in this piece. Is it possible that this jersey (and maybe a few others) were made for Rose after the original batch were made for 83' in mid to late season and by that time they had changed their production from the silk collar to the 84' style collar? We know Rose was giving items (or selling) away even back then and I would imagine that the team would also have given away some of his items to maybe big advertisers given how popular he was. The jersey looks perfect in every other aspect and it doesn't look like one made up, so there must be an explanation...

Dave

[hblakewolf]

Dave-
Good question, but no.

Note it is set 1. If it was a replacement, it would most likely be set 2.

I have had the stars, commons and call-ups. All were either tagged set 1, or set 2 and ALL had the satin in the collar. Even the late season call ups had satin, and a few had no name in the collar, as it appears the "extras" the Phillies ordered were void of a name in collar.

The plastic zipper was only used in 1983. If the shirt in question was made in 1984, it would have a metal zipper.

Anything is possible, however, based on the dozens of 1983 jerseys I have sold, I would not be comfortable owning this particular jersey.

Have a great weekend.

Howard Wolf
hblakewolf@patmedia.net


Howard,

This is an honest question from me as I was interested in this piece. Is it possible that this jersey (and maybe a few others) were made for Rose after the original batch were made for 83' in mid to late season and by that time they had changed their production from the silk collar to the 84' style collar? We know Rose was giving items (or selling) away even back then and I would imagine that the team would also have given away some of his items to maybe big advertisers given how popular he was. The jersey looks perfect in every other aspect and it doesn't look like one made up, so there must be an explanation...

Dave