I need some advice on Mantle bat

[ClaudiaM]

1999 The Sothebys Auction of the Barry Halper Collection,

(info as printed in the auction catalog)

lot #1601
Mickey Mantle Signed Game Used Bat
This 1960-1964 H&B Professional Model K55 shows moderate game use. The barrel has been inscribed by Mantle in green ink "to Barry -Thanks for everything- Your Friend Mickey Mantle- 2/5/88 (9/10) in excellent condition 33 oz length 34 1/2 in. (87 .6 cm)


The bat was sold at auction for $20,700.00, then resold to Upper Deck, which was entered in a sweepstakes , and was won by my mother.
Taxes were paid on the value. We have been trying to sell the bat and upon studying about game used bats, have found that ( awaiting verification from the bat maker ) Mantle never ordered the 34 1/2 inch bat and that it possibly was considered a "never left the field house bat", and if that is the case the bat is not worth a fraction of what the prize that was offered , taxes paid etc. I have also an issue with the authenticator of the bat for Sothebys. I'm wanting to see what legal action can be taken to get a "real" bat , or compensated by the auction house or Upper Deck.

thanks
Claudia

[legaleagle92481]

I agree with STLHAMMER32 in the other thread. It will be hard if not impossible to prove it one way or the other, the team could have ordered it and he could have used it. Someone has apparently already authenticated it so I would go ahead and consign it to a major auction house (not Ebay which stuff always goes much cheaper on) and let the market decide. If you wanted to you could submit it to a second authneticator MEARS and PSADNA are two that are well respect for bat authentication, to get a second opinion to bolster your case. A major factor in favor of it being used from a practical standpoint is the fact that Barry Halper was a world famous collector who once owned part of the Yankees and was friends with Mantle, who from the inscription appears to have given him the bat. Why would Mickey have given his friend something that was not the genuine article? And the bat was obviuosly used by someone.

If instead you were convinced that the bat was not used by Mantle and wanted to pursue a legal case contact your local bar association to find an attorney, most give free consultations and they will only take your case if they feel there is at least some merit as an attorney faces disciplinary action if he or she files frivoulous lawsuits.

[MSpecht]

Hi Claudia. Here are some thoughts to consider --- (link to auction is http://www.sothebys.com/app/live/lot/LotDetail.jsp?lot_id=W9PB (http://www.sothebys.com/app/live/lot/LotDetail.jsp?lot_id=W9PB)

Mickey Mantle Model K55 bats generate some of the most controversial discussions in the hobby when it comes to their appearance (or non-appearance) in Mantle's personal H & B ordering records, the Yankess team H & B ordering records, and "I got this straight from a Yankee batboy" stories. Mantle's potential use of any particular K55 bat that does not appear in his personal H & B records is highly debatable and must go beyond the records and be determined by (opinion) very specific Mantle use characteristics.

In this auction, an interesting thing that jumps out is that the bat is described as a 1961-64 label bat, however the personalized signature is dated 2/5/1988. This leads to one of two possibilities: 1) either Mantle had a bunch of (or maybe just one) game used bats from 25 or more years earlier just lying around for his use as gifts, etc, or 2) Halper had obtained this bat at some point during his many Yankee-collecting years and eventually had Mantle sign it in 1988.

At any rate, you will need assistance in any legal pursuit, but the auction does not maintain that the bat was specifically game used by Mantle (although the implication is there), and it is unknown who did the authentication and whether the authentication is for the signature, the bat being game used (by someone), or that the bat is a professional model bat with no opinion as to game use by a specific person.

I am not certain on how items are valued in a UDA contest for tax purposes, but it should be relatively easy to determine the difference in actual market values between a generic Mantle signed bat, a professional model Mantle signed bat, and a professional model game used (by Mantle) Mantle signed bat.

The suggestions on where to find assistance are good --- both PSA/DNA and MEARS do quality research and authentications. In my opinion, however, THE expert on Mickey Mantle bats specifically is Vince Malta, who also can be reached through PSA/DNA. You also need to consider the cost of the fight as well....if the endgame is the difference between a 15 % or 20 % tax bite on say $ 6000 vs. $ 20,000, the numbers may not pencil out in attorney's fees, experts fees, and expended time.

Good Luck

Mike

[sox83cubs84]

[quote=legaleagle92481;177238] Why would Mickey have given his friend something that was not the genuine article?

Don't automatically assume that's a given. In the late 1980s, I used several SCD columns to publicize the Scholarship Fund that Terry Steinbach of Oakland had set up and helped fund via by-mail autograph requests. In 1989, I asked him if I could buy a game-worn jersey for a donation through his agent. I sent in the donation, and received a package containg a size 48 Rawlings "authentic" jersey that never saw the Oakland clubhouse.

Dave M.
Chicago area

[gameused]

1999 The Sothebys Auction of the Barry Halper Collection,

(info as printed in the auction catalog)

lot #1601
Mickey Mantle Signed Game Used Bat
This 1960-1964 H&B Professional Model K55 shows moderate game use. The barrel has been inscribed by Mantle in green ink "to Barry -Thanks for everything- Your Friend Mickey Mantle- 2/5/88 (9/10) in excellent condition 33 oz length 34 1/2 in. (87 .6 cm)


The bat was sold at auction for $20,700.00, then resold to Upper Deck, which was entered in a sweepstakes , and was won by my mother.
Taxes were paid on the value. We have been trying to sell the bat and upon studying about game used bats, have found that ( awaiting verification from the bat maker ) Mantle never ordered the 34 1/2 inch bat and that it possibly was considered a "never left the field house bat", and if that is the case the bat is not worth a fraction of what the prize that was offered , taxes paid etc. I have also an issue with the authenticator of the bat for Sothebys. I'm wanting to see what legal action can be taken to get a "real" bat , or compensated by the auction house or Upper Deck.

thanks
Claudia


Claudia,

You feel you been mislead and paid taxes on an item that is basically not worth 20 grand, yet you offer this same bat on eBay and make no mention that it may not be game used and is definetly not worth the starting bid price of $20,700
http://cgi.ebay.com/Mickey-Mantle-Game-Used-Autographed-Bat_W0QQitemZ130354247112QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_Def aultDomain_0?hash=item1e59b7f5c8#ht_500wt_948

Seems like your trying to profit at someone else's expense!

Bobby

[ClaudiaM]

Thats not true, I in good faith posted the bat on e bay, it wasn't until I had several people point out issues with the bat, the people that asked about the bat got a response from me that until further information from sothebys and a beter authentication that the bat was not for sale. I am very upset to think you would assume the worst, and I have posted on this site to educate my self on the things to look for and what to do. NOT to cheat people

[gameused]

Seen that you ended the auction, when I posted my response the auction was still open. I apologize and applaud you for doing the right thing. Hope all works out for you.

Bobby

[ClaudiaM]

Thank you very much