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3arod13
05-07-2009, 05:21 PM
No More Excuses For Manny Ramirez - No Accident!

ESPN reported earlier that testing showed Ramirez had used hCG, which is typically used by steroid users to restart their bodies' natural testosterone production as they come off a steroid cycle. It is similar to Clomid, the drug Barry Bonds (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?playerId=1785), Jason Giambi (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?playerId=3226) and others used as clients of BALCO.

With this said, and the unbelievable numbers Manny put up with the Dodgers in a short period at the end of last season, says enough.

For those who want to believe this happened to Manny by accident...wake up! For those who want to believe Manny didn't do it with Boston...WAKE UP!!

No question in my mind, Manny is on the list of the 103 players who tested positive.

Regard, Tony (A happy Arod fan today)

justinlm24
05-07-2009, 05:27 PM
No More Excuses For Manny Ramirez - No Accident!

ESPN reported earlier that testing showed Ramirez had used hCG, which is typically used by steroid users to restart their bodies' natural testosterone production as they come off a steroid cycle. It is similar to Clomid, the drug Barry Bonds (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?playerId=1785), Jason Giambi (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?playerId=3226) and others used as clients of BALCO.

With this said, and the unbelievable numbers Manny put up with the Dodgers in a short period at the end of last season, says enough.

For those who want to believe this happened to Manny by accident...wake up! For those who want to believe Manny didn't do it with Boston...WAKE UP!!



No question in my mind, Manny is on the list of the 103 players who tested positive.

Regard, Tony (A happy Arod fan today)

We all realize you're obviously a Yankee fan, so if you're looking for a way to diminish what the sox have accomplished you may as well keep reaching. No one will ever know 100% when he was or wasn't using. Maybe he was with the sox, maybe he wasn't. But Manny did not win the two world series as a one man team. We all know Manny has talent. He didn't get to where he is by cheating year in and year out. Hopefully you don't honestly believe that. Who can prove A-rod hasn't been using since he came up to the majors?? A-rod and Manny are now in the same boat. Neither is no less wrong than the other.

eisenreich8
05-07-2009, 05:31 PM
My perspnal vitriolic comments regarding this mega-fraud were not made lightly, following his signing with LA, and I am about as ecstatic about this news as can be. This guy is, although a talented bat, a seriously warped individual and a horrible team cancer who now will hopefully reap the same rewards that are being bestowed on Palmeiro, McGwire, Bonds, Clemens, Arod and others.

SEE YA!

#1 Happy Red Sox Fan For Life

earlywynnfan
05-07-2009, 05:31 PM
Where did he try to diminish what the Red Sox have done? I must be missing it.

Ken
earlywynnfan5@hotmail.com

3arod13
05-07-2009, 05:34 PM
We all realize you're obviously a Yankee fan, so if you're looking for a way to diminish what the sox have accomplished you may as well keep reaching. No one will ever know 100% when he was or wasn't using. Maybe he was with the sox, maybe he wasn't. But Manny did not win the two world series as a one man team. We all know Manny has talent. He didn't get to where he is by cheating year in and year out. Hopefully you don't honestly believe that. Who can prove A-rod hasn't been using since he came up to the majors?? A-rod and Manny are now in the same boat. Neither is no less wrong than the other.

I'm not saying anything about the Red Sox or their accomplishments. My comments were directed only at Manny Ramirez.

You're wrong. Arod is in the "I admit I did it boat." Manny is in the "I'm gonna like about it" boat.

Arod's boat is still above water. Manny's boat is sinking....

godwulf
05-07-2009, 05:35 PM
With this said, and the unbelievable numbers Manny put up with the Dodgers in a short period at the end of last season, says enough.

So...could we maybe make the '08 National League Western Division championship race a do-over?

No, huh? :cool:

3arod13
05-07-2009, 05:36 PM
I'm not saying anything about the Red Sox or their accomplishments. My comments were directed only at Manny Ramirez.

You're wrong. Arod is in the "I admit I did it boat." Manny is in the "I'm gonna like about it" boat.

Arod's boat is still above water. Manny's boat is sinking....

Sorry, meant "You're wrong. Arod is in the "I admit I did it boat." Manny is in the "I'm gonna lie about it" boat.

3arod13
05-07-2009, 05:37 PM
Look...you guys have to get off defending your teams. Comments are directed at Manny Ramirez. Not the Red Sox! Not the Dodgers!

Stay focussed and on course.

justinlm24
05-07-2009, 05:49 PM
I'm not saying anything about the Red Sox or their accomplishments. My comments were directed only at Manny Ramirez.

You're wrong. Arod is in the "I admit I did it boat." Manny is in the "I'm gonna like about it" boat.

Arod's boat is still above water. Manny's boat is sinking....
By saying he used while with the red sox, when there is no facts behind that, is indirectly saying that. If you, or anyone, had facts to prove that then fine. I could live with it. I am not defending the Sox, no need to. Manny doesn't play for us anymore and I'm glad he doesn't.....

3arod13
05-07-2009, 05:52 PM
By saying he used while with the red sox, when there is no facts behind that, is indirectly saying that. If you, or anyone, had facts to prove that then fine. I could live with it. I am not defending the Sox, no need to. Manny doesn't play for us anymore and I'm glad he doesn't.....

I will bet my home on it, that if the remaining names on the list come out, Manny Ramirez is on it! That's how positive I am!

justinlm24
05-07-2009, 05:52 PM
Sorry, meant "You're wrong. Arod is in the "I admit I did it boat." Manny is in the "I'm gonna lie about it" boat.
So you're saying A-rod didn't lie about it?? Arod did lie about it. And later admitted he lied about it. How do you know Ramirez will not do the same? I am still a fan of Manny, always will be. What he has done he now has to live with it. It's a shame when any great player gets busted for this crap. It only hurts the game. I think that's what bothers me the most.

justinlm24
05-07-2009, 05:54 PM
I will bet my home on it, that if the remaining names on the list come out, Manny Ramirez is on it! That's how positive I am!
And if, and when, they do and he is on it.....then so be it. But until then I don't think he was. There was never a spike in production. If he was taking them then it obviously didn't help him produce no more that he already was.....it just doesn't add up to me.

3arod13
05-07-2009, 06:00 PM
So you're saying A-rod didn't lie about it?? Arod did lie about it. And later admitted he lied about it. How do you know Ramirez will not do the same? I am still a fan of Manny, always will be. What he has done he now has to live with it. It's a shame when any great player gets busted for this crap. It only hurts the game. I think that's what bothers me the most.

Of course he lied about it before it was proven he did test positive. Who wouldn't. The difference is, when he did get caught because of a positive test, he admitted it. I believe his story was a bunch of bull, but he admitted it. Most likely to protect other players.

Not only did he admit it, he admitted it for an additional 2 years, when he could have easily came out and just said 2003, as proven and accused of.

Look, don't get so defensive. It is what it is. There are more than 100 others who tested positive. There are probably 100 more who did get caught.

This era is a sad era for everyone. If you go back and look at every post or comment I made about Arod, not once did I justify or defend him.

I'm still a fan of Arod. Just not proud of what he did.

Regards, Tony

kellsox
05-07-2009, 06:02 PM
Sorry, meant "You're wrong. Arod is in the "I admit I did it boat." Manny is in the "I'm gonna lie about it" boat.
Arod only "admitted it" because his back was against the wall. Lets not make him out to be better than the other users. People would also be crazy to think that he stopped when he claimed that he did. Lets not forget Arod did his share of time in the "I'm going to lie about it boat" until the word of the Roberts book came to light. The events of the past year reinforces the idea that NO player can be viewed as being 100% clean.

justinlm24
05-07-2009, 06:04 PM
No getting defensive. I just hate this. I love baseball and this stuff is ruining the game. It really makes no difference to me who gets caught. Wheather it's a big star or a no name player. It's bad for the game either way. Like you with A-rod, I'll still be a fan of manny. I'm glad he isn't on my team, but still a fan just the same. It really makes no difference who, why, or how, or when a player does it. It shouldn't be done period. I'm for a zero tolerance policy on this nonsense. You get caught....you get banned for life.

3arod13
05-07-2009, 06:07 PM
No getting defensive. I just hate this. I love baseball and this stuff is ruining the game. It really makes no difference to me who gets caught. Wheather it's a big star or a no name player. It's bad for the game either way. Like you with A-rod, I'll still be a fan of manny. I'm glad he isn't on my team, but still a fan just the same. It really makes no difference who, why, or how, or when a player does it. It shouldn't be done period. I'm for a zero tolerance policy on this nonsense. You get caught....you get banned for life.

Agree! As an Arod fan, I look at it for what it is. Do I believe Arod would be an average player if he didn't use? No! He didn't need it. It was definately stupid. I too love baseball, and wish all of this never happened. But if many honestly believe many other players in the past didn't cheat, you are mistaken. There are/were many other ways of cheating to get an edge over other players.

3arod13
05-07-2009, 06:18 PM
Do you think it was fair for a pitcher to scuff a ball, or use vasaline to make the ball do more than what he could do with it naturally? Do you think it was fair to the batter and other team? Do you think it was fair that doing it produced better numbers for the pitcher, compared to other pitchers that were pitching with their natural ability.

We just happen to be in the drug era. In the past, cheating was common to get an edge on other players.

Funny thing is, for those of you younger guys, you may not realize that back then (back in the day), the media didn't report the negative stuff they do today. The media back then protected players. It was a different mindset them.

FastLane80
05-07-2009, 06:18 PM
My perspnal vitriolic comments regarding this mega-fraud were not made lightly, following his signing with LA, and I am about as ecstatic about this news as can be. This guy is, although a talented bat, a seriously warped individual and a horrible team cancer who now will hopefully reap the same rewards that are being bestowed on Palmeiro, McGwire, Bonds, Clemens, Arod and others.

SEE YA!

#1 Happy Red Sox Fan For LifeI'm sorry but I'm sick of the Red Sox fans pouting about the break up. This time last year, Boston fans were licking this guy's boots and had been for 7 years. He wasn't a cancer when he was the World Series MVP, hitting 200+ regular season home runs and plenty of post season shots but now that he left in a manner that was unfavorable for both sides, he was all of a sudden a cancer? No one can deny what he did at the end of his career in Boston was immature and unprofessional but cursing his name and calling him a 'mega-fraud' is juvenile in itself.

I think we are all missing the bigger picture here. Not only has he tainted his reputation but he's also put yet another black-eye on the game itself. The grandstanding of these negative situations by those that dislike a player for one reason or another is selfish and disgraceful.

eisenreich8
05-07-2009, 06:29 PM
I'm sorry but I'm sick of the Red Sox fans pouting about the break up. This time last year, Boston fans were licking this guy's boots and had been for 7 years. He wasn't a cancer when he was the World Series MVP, hitting 200+ regular season home runs and plenty of post season shots but now that he left in a manner that was unfavorable for both sides, he was all of a sudden a cancer? No one can deny what he did at the end of his career in Boston was immature and unprofessional but cursing his name and calling him a 'mega-fraud' is juvenile in itself.

I think we are all missing the bigger picture here. Not only has he tainted his reputation but he's also put yet another black-eye on the game itself. The grandstanding of these negative situations by those that dislike a player for one reason or another is selfish and disgraceful.



If you care to, read my posts from3-4 months ago. I stand by my comments/opinions whether you agree or not.

"Boston fans" didn't adore Manny, they abhorred Manny. Only 7 year old kids fawned over him. If you didn't/don't intimately know the Boston sports scene you are lacking the knowledge necessary to engage in debate about Ramirez during his Boston days. Mark Freakin' Bellhorn was more valuable to the Red Sox during the 2004 postseason that Ramirez was. Look it up.

As is the case with any forum one might comment on, you're free to take issue with opinions expressed by the members but realize that they don't always jibe with your take on things. Manny was a turd in Boston, and if he juiced while there too, it just makes it worse.

FastLane80
05-07-2009, 07:02 PM
If you care to, read my posts from3-4 months ago. I stand by my comments/opinions whether you agree or not.

"Boston fans" didn't adore Manny, they abhorred Manny. Only 7 year old kids fawned over him. If you didn't/don't intimately know the Boston sports scene you are lacking the knowledge necessary to engage in debate about Ramirez during his Boston days. Mark Freakin' Bellhorn was more valuable to the Red Sox during the 2004 postseason that Ramirez was. Look it up.

As is the case with any forum one might comment on, you're free to take issue with opinions expressed by the members but realize that they don't always jibe with your take on things. Manny was a turd in Boston, and if he juiced while there too, it just makes it worse.I'll admit, I am not in the midst of the Red Sox Nation here in the southwest and my general knowledge of the Red Sox comes from what I see on ESPN and here from the Soxs fans out here who I assume are not as committed as those that actually live in the New England area. It's not fair for me to comment on real Red Sox fans just as I'm sure you're unable to get a proper feel for a real Dodger fan out there. For that, I plead ignorance...just like Manny :p. What does bother me though is that people are joyful over something that is about more than just Manny. I presume you're a dedicated baseball fan like me and I think the disdain you and others feel for Manny overlooks the fact that this is hurting baseball.

quiggle28
05-07-2009, 07:46 PM
Red Sox 2004 World Champions *

eisenreich8
05-07-2009, 08:04 PM
Red Sox 2004 World Champions *

Don't forget 2007 * !

bigtime59
05-08-2009, 09:20 AM
Of course he lied about it before it was proven he did test positive. Who wouldn't. The difference is, when he did get caught because of a positive test, he admitted it. I believe his story was a bunch of bull, but he admitted it. Most likely to protect other players.

Not only did he admit it, he admitted it for an additional 2 years, when he could have easily came out and just said 2003, as proven and accused of.

Look, don't get so defensive. It is what it is. There are more than 100 others who tested positive. There are probably 100 more who did get caught.

This era is a sad era for everyone. If you go back and look at every post or comment I made about Arod, not once did I justify or defend him.

I'm still a fan of Arod. Just not proud of what he did.

Regards, Tony

Most likely to protect other players?
Most likely to protect other players?
Most likely to protect other players?
Well, I need a new keyboard now, because I just sprayed my morning "wake up taste" all over it! I know you're a fan of Miss Pay-Fraud and all, but even you must realize that--in her world--there are no other players, just a determined, dogged march to the Hall of Fame and recognition as the "greatest ever"? And that everyone else is merely a supporting or bit player? Kind of like how the Yankee$ feel about the other 29 teams?
Manny got caught. He's guilty of something. Miss Pay-Fraud got caught. She's guilty of something. But if you think Manny's getting caught makes Miss Pay-Fraud any less of an insincere, emotionally stunted freak show, well, sorry, amigo...you're wrong.

bigtime59
05-08-2009, 09:23 AM
Red Sox 2004 World Champions *


Yankee$ (insert year) World Champions $
(And believe me, I'm no Red $ox fan, so don't go there!)

notxpensv4u
05-08-2009, 10:30 AM
AROD = Cheated on a game we love, Cheated on a wife he once loved, Sells merchandise (whatever it may be) to make a dollar, Lie after lie if this is a "role model" then I will go back and look at my own dad who stayed married and dedicated to my mom for 35 years, make an honest living while working hard and provided for a family with no lies. If your a fan of Arod then be prepared for another "letdown".

Rob L
05-08-2009, 10:32 AM
Wow. There was just a report that Baseball has been monitoring Manny for a while now. Sounds like he was also on the "list" of 103 players. No wonder Baseball doesn't want to release the rest of it. How many more will fall!!!

halofan
05-08-2009, 10:35 AM
I wonder if Vlad is on that list

3arod13
05-08-2009, 10:54 AM
Wow. There was just a report that Baseball has been monitoring Manny for a while now. Sounds like he was also on the "list" of 103 players. No wonder Baseball doesn't want to release the rest of it. How many more will fall!!!

I don't doubt there are many more players than the 103 who tested positive.

Do you think it was fair for a pitcher to scuff a ball, or use vasaline to make the ball do more than what he could do with it naturally? Do you think it was fair to the batter and other team? Do you think it was fair that doing it produced better numbers for the pitcher, compared to other pitchers that were pitching with their natural ability.

We just happen to be in the drug era. In the past, cheating was common to get an edge on other players.

Regards, Tony

Rob L
05-08-2009, 11:02 AM
I wonder if Vlad is on that list

Hmm. Vlad worked out with the same trainer as Arod and ManRam. A little HGH would go along way in repairing that pectoral muscle tear!!!

eisenreich8
05-08-2009, 11:25 AM
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/columns/story?columnist=stark_jayson&id=4150444

3arod13
05-08-2009, 11:33 AM
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/columns/story?columnist=stark_jayson&id=4150444

If Manny is one of those 103 who tested positive, which names haven't come out, then way take the chance after all this to continue to do it (if he did)?

suicide_squeeze
05-08-2009, 02:35 PM
I'm as big a Dodger fan.....and baseball fan in general......as you will ever meet.

That said, I was also one of the hughest Manny fans, because the guy is talented.

Now, my honesty and my opinion. I was hoping news never came out about this player as falling into the dreaded PED using pile of dung. Well, it looks as though he has.

I have had many a discussion on several boards, this being just one of them, on Manny and what a bad human being he is. I was steadfast in my support of the guy. I was warned on how stupid the guy was. I was warned on what a scumbag he was, on how he didn't do the right things in representing his team, or baseball for that matter. I was warned that if it wasn't to benefit Manny, it wasn't done by Manny.

I'm no dummie.....I sit in the stands and I lokk at Manny's thick chest and huge rounded strong shoulders.....and I think "No way is that from a solid 'Work ethic' alone". But I always hoped......please, Manny, don't ever come out as one of the "names".

In view of the news yesterday morning, and the subsequent news about the "medication" his Florida doctor prescribed......I am no longer a Manny fan. Period.

He has single-handedly ruined the Dodgers season, no matter what they do now short of winning a World Championship, he has crapped down the throats of his fans, he has alienated his fan base, and after his (and Boras's) disgraceful handling of his re-signing.......I'm done with this news.

What a moron. What a disgraceful stupid absolutely selfish scumbag low-life deceitful cheating f&%k.

Deport him. I'm so disgusted by all of this whole baseball generation.

It's time to get serious about it all.

MLB needs to fire Bud Selig already, and put in place an even more strict diciplinarian as Commish. And they need to make the rules more harsh.

The only solace the Dodgers can take out of this whole mess is that Manny lost almost $8 million for his stupidity.

ANd why isn't someone going after these so-called "Doctors" who are enabling these athletes to do these things? These bums should have their medical licenses revolked. What is WRONG with our legal system?

It all just points back to the great players of old. They were.....and still are, the true champions of our sport. Long live the Babe Ruth's, Ted Williams, Lou Gehrig's, Stan Musial's, Hank Aaron's, even Roger Maris's of the game.

They were pure. This group today is disgraceful.

3arod13
05-08-2009, 02:46 PM
I'm as big a Dodger fan.....and baseball fan in general......as you will ever meet.

That said, I was also one of the hughest Manny fans, because the guy is talented.

Now, my honesty and my opinion. I was hoping news never came out about this player as falling into the dreaded PED using pile of dung. Well, it looks as though he has.

I have had many a discussion on several boards, this being just one of them, on Manny and what a bad human being he is. I was steadfast in my support of the guy. I was warned on how stupid the guy was. I was warned on what a scumbag he was, on how he didn't do the right things in representing his team, or baseball for that matter. I was warned that if it wasn't to benefit Manny, it wasn't done by Manny.

I'm no dummie.....I sit in the stands and I lokk at Manny's thick chest and huge rounded strong shoulders.....and I think "No way is that from a solid 'Work ethic' alone". But I always hoped......please, Manny, don't ever come out as one of the "names".

In view of the news yesterday morning, and the subsequent news about the "medication" his Florida doctor prescribed......I am no longer a Manny fan. Period.

He has single-handedly ruined the Dodgers season, no matter what they do now short of winning a World Championship, he has crapped down the throats of his fans, he has alienated his fan base, and after his (and Boras's) disgraceful handling of his re-signing.......I'm done with this news.

What a moron. What a disgraceful stupid absolutely selfish scumbag low-life deceitful cheating f&%k.

Deport him. I'm so disgusted by all of this whole baseball generation.

It's time to get serious about it all.

MLB needs to fire Bud Selig already, and put in place an even more strict diciplinarian as Commish. And they need to make the rules more harsh.

The only solace the Dodgers can take out of this whole mess is that Manny lost almost $8 million for his stupidity.

ANd why isn't someone going after these so-called "Doctors" who are enabling these athletes to do these things? These bums should have their medical licenses revolked. What is WRONG with our legal system?

It all just points back to the great players of old. They were.....and still are, the true champions of our sport. Long live the Babe Ruth's, Ted Williams, Lou Gehrig's, Stan Musial's, Hank Aaron's, even Roger Maris's of the game.

They were pure. This group today is disgraceful.

Although I understand your pain and what you're going through right now, it will pass.

I've been an Arod fan since he was in the minors. I know Arod is talented. I know he didn't need enhancers. However, it was the era he came into and many many players were doing it. Many will never come to surface, but many were. It is what it is. Yes, there were many that made the right decision not to do it, and I have more respect for those players.

I watch Arod taking a beating day after day after day. Doesn't bother me at all. Everyone has their own opinions.

JETEFAN
05-08-2009, 03:36 PM
Major league baseball should make it a rule, you must take steroids to play in the bigs !! You don't use, out you go....problem solved. How bout them Yankees !!!

George