Moustache Gang
11-23-2008, 02:45 PM
Forum members,
Recently I went back and forth with MEARS on a game used Reggie Jackson they authenticated as actually worn by Reggie in 1971. Troy and I went back and forth with my evidence as to it not being worn by Reggie and by 5 pm yesterday Troy would not agree with me. I then posted my findings on the MEARS website and within one hour Dave Grob posted a statement stating that I was correct and they errored in the assessment of the supposed Reggie Jackson game used jersey. I applaud Dave and MEARS for quickly seeing that the evidence I provided overwhelmingly illustrated that Reggie never wore that jersey. I will submit a post later describing my positive experience with MEARS and how I believe they can be a leader in this industry.
With that stated I do want to discuss the Jim Brown jersey that has been quite the talk over the last couple of days and compare the term "light game use" and why I believe MEARS still has problems with the evaluation and scoring system. Here is the posting I just listed on the MEARS website.
Dave Grob,
In April of 2007 I was the winning bidder on a 1974 Rollie Fingers game used Oakland A’s green knit jersey from REA. It was accompanied with a MEARS evaluation and it was scored an A-8. I thought nothing of the assessment at the time and never even reviewed it, but placed it into my stack of other LOAs. About a year later in 2008, as I was discussing with Troy the obvious discrepancies with MEARS' A’s game used jersey evaluations and I pulled out the ’74 Fingers assessment and immediately noticed that this jersey was miss-evaluated like other A’s jerseys MEARS has assessed in the past.
MEARS gave a final score of the ’74 Fingers an A-8 and subtracted two points for “light game use”. Light game use as compared to what? Compared to other relief pitchers? Compared to other A’s jerseys? I then systematically laid out evidence to Troy illustrating that the Fingers jersey did not show “light game use” and had as much wear as the other 50+ A’s game used knits I have. I compared the ’74 green Fingers to a ’74 green Joe Rudi which sit side-by-side in my collection….
Joe Rudi was a solid outfield for the A’s who played very hard day in and day out. Rollie Fingers was hall of fame relief pitcher who pitched on average just over one inning per game he appeared it.
Evidence #1: In 1974 Joe Rudi played in 158 games and had 593 plate appearances which can easily equate to 600+ innings played and is probably way beyond that number. In 1974, Rollie Fingers appeared in 76 games and pitched in 119 innings. Rudi easily played in 5 times as many innings as Fingers, yet these jerseys exhibit the same amount of wears.
Evidence #2: Rudi had 593 plate appearances, Fingers 119 innings and yet the jerseys exhibit the same amount of wear. As a matter of fact, the Fingers jersey exhibits dirtier lettering in the name than the Rudi.
Evidence #3: Fingers was a relief pitcher who sat in the bullpen many times wearing a jacket. Rudi started and played left field for the A’s in almost every game in the ’74 season, yet the jerseys exhibit the same amount of wear.
Evidence #4 Rudi slides into bases, slides and falls into the grassy outfield and digs deep into the batter’s box. Fingers throws balls to the catcher from the mound and never bats the ball and rarely fields a ball, yet both these jerseys exhibit the same amount of wear.
Evidence #5: To my knowledge and I could be wrong, the A’s were the only team to wear three different jerseys meaning at a minimum they had 6 jerseys (2 of each color) and would wear their jerseys less than compared to other MLB teams in 1974, yet again the Fingers and Rudi show great game wear and hey exhibit the same amount of wear.
I listed additional reasons and evidence illustrating that both the Rudi and Fingers were pristine examples of A’s game worn jerseys from 1974. Troy agreed with me on all points. Troy also agree to re-examine the jersey in June 0f 2008 which he and I have not made arrangements yet to do so. There is no doubt in my mind that both the Rudi and the Fingers should be graded an A-10 and the Fingers does not show “light game use”.
Now MEARS grades a recent Jim Brown game used Cleveland Browns jersey in the REA and what appears to be the same jersey in the latest Mastro auction. I am by no means a game used football jersey expert and would never claim to be, nor have I ever witnessed in person the game use of this jersey like I have with my Rudi and Fingers jersey, but if you look at the jersey online and in the catalogs and you read the recent description of the jersey in the Mastro auction it really points to the jersey having light game use.
Here is the Mastro description of the Jim Brown jersey…
“As to its evidence of game play, the "tear-away"-style dark uniform top exhibits light surface stress marks to the numbers, as well as slight fraying to the reinforced button holes on the crotch piece. There are no team repairs, suggesting short-term overall usage most likely during the hot weather of early season games.”
I never saw Jim Brown play in person, but I have observed many game films of him in action. This guy doled out as much punishment as what was handed to him by some of the biggest names in football. Not just that he was Jim Brown, but the position in which he played, running back, literally puts a lot of wear onto his jerseys. Yet this jersey based on many collectors’ views and even the write up in Mastro's auction indicate anything but medium or heavy use. This jersey does exhibit light game use, especially when you consider the position Jim Brown played.
Now based on all the above information, how can my Rollie Fingers (relief pitcher) jersey score a MEARS A-8 subtracted -2 for “light game use” yet Jim Brown, Hall of Fame running back in a full-contact sport get an A-10 when it clearly exhibits light game use?? Dave you have to be kidding me!!!
Could it be because Dave Bushing owns the Jim Brown jersey that he rubber stamps the A-10 on “his” jersey or “Troy’s” jersey” or that Dave Bushing has more to gain financially from an A-10 than an A-8?
This is why collectors are upset with the MEARS grading system and the conflicts of interest that members of MEARS have displayed in the past. You cannot give an A-10 to a football jersey with little game use and then turn around and subtract -2 point for a relief pitcher’s jersey that exhibits the same use as his fellow teammate who played in 158 games in the same year. There is no way you can have it both ways Dave.
I can further illustrate to you that MEARS has miss-evaluated both the 1974 Rollie Fingers jersey and the Jim Brown Cleveland Browns jersey.
Again I am one of your biggest supporters and I am one of your biggest critics.
Mark Weimerskirch
Recently I went back and forth with MEARS on a game used Reggie Jackson they authenticated as actually worn by Reggie in 1971. Troy and I went back and forth with my evidence as to it not being worn by Reggie and by 5 pm yesterday Troy would not agree with me. I then posted my findings on the MEARS website and within one hour Dave Grob posted a statement stating that I was correct and they errored in the assessment of the supposed Reggie Jackson game used jersey. I applaud Dave and MEARS for quickly seeing that the evidence I provided overwhelmingly illustrated that Reggie never wore that jersey. I will submit a post later describing my positive experience with MEARS and how I believe they can be a leader in this industry.
With that stated I do want to discuss the Jim Brown jersey that has been quite the talk over the last couple of days and compare the term "light game use" and why I believe MEARS still has problems with the evaluation and scoring system. Here is the posting I just listed on the MEARS website.
Dave Grob,
In April of 2007 I was the winning bidder on a 1974 Rollie Fingers game used Oakland A’s green knit jersey from REA. It was accompanied with a MEARS evaluation and it was scored an A-8. I thought nothing of the assessment at the time and never even reviewed it, but placed it into my stack of other LOAs. About a year later in 2008, as I was discussing with Troy the obvious discrepancies with MEARS' A’s game used jersey evaluations and I pulled out the ’74 Fingers assessment and immediately noticed that this jersey was miss-evaluated like other A’s jerseys MEARS has assessed in the past.
MEARS gave a final score of the ’74 Fingers an A-8 and subtracted two points for “light game use”. Light game use as compared to what? Compared to other relief pitchers? Compared to other A’s jerseys? I then systematically laid out evidence to Troy illustrating that the Fingers jersey did not show “light game use” and had as much wear as the other 50+ A’s game used knits I have. I compared the ’74 green Fingers to a ’74 green Joe Rudi which sit side-by-side in my collection….
Joe Rudi was a solid outfield for the A’s who played very hard day in and day out. Rollie Fingers was hall of fame relief pitcher who pitched on average just over one inning per game he appeared it.
Evidence #1: In 1974 Joe Rudi played in 158 games and had 593 plate appearances which can easily equate to 600+ innings played and is probably way beyond that number. In 1974, Rollie Fingers appeared in 76 games and pitched in 119 innings. Rudi easily played in 5 times as many innings as Fingers, yet these jerseys exhibit the same amount of wears.
Evidence #2: Rudi had 593 plate appearances, Fingers 119 innings and yet the jerseys exhibit the same amount of wear. As a matter of fact, the Fingers jersey exhibits dirtier lettering in the name than the Rudi.
Evidence #3: Fingers was a relief pitcher who sat in the bullpen many times wearing a jacket. Rudi started and played left field for the A’s in almost every game in the ’74 season, yet the jerseys exhibit the same amount of wear.
Evidence #4 Rudi slides into bases, slides and falls into the grassy outfield and digs deep into the batter’s box. Fingers throws balls to the catcher from the mound and never bats the ball and rarely fields a ball, yet both these jerseys exhibit the same amount of wear.
Evidence #5: To my knowledge and I could be wrong, the A’s were the only team to wear three different jerseys meaning at a minimum they had 6 jerseys (2 of each color) and would wear their jerseys less than compared to other MLB teams in 1974, yet again the Fingers and Rudi show great game wear and hey exhibit the same amount of wear.
I listed additional reasons and evidence illustrating that both the Rudi and Fingers were pristine examples of A’s game worn jerseys from 1974. Troy agreed with me on all points. Troy also agree to re-examine the jersey in June 0f 2008 which he and I have not made arrangements yet to do so. There is no doubt in my mind that both the Rudi and the Fingers should be graded an A-10 and the Fingers does not show “light game use”.
Now MEARS grades a recent Jim Brown game used Cleveland Browns jersey in the REA and what appears to be the same jersey in the latest Mastro auction. I am by no means a game used football jersey expert and would never claim to be, nor have I ever witnessed in person the game use of this jersey like I have with my Rudi and Fingers jersey, but if you look at the jersey online and in the catalogs and you read the recent description of the jersey in the Mastro auction it really points to the jersey having light game use.
Here is the Mastro description of the Jim Brown jersey…
“As to its evidence of game play, the "tear-away"-style dark uniform top exhibits light surface stress marks to the numbers, as well as slight fraying to the reinforced button holes on the crotch piece. There are no team repairs, suggesting short-term overall usage most likely during the hot weather of early season games.”
I never saw Jim Brown play in person, but I have observed many game films of him in action. This guy doled out as much punishment as what was handed to him by some of the biggest names in football. Not just that he was Jim Brown, but the position in which he played, running back, literally puts a lot of wear onto his jerseys. Yet this jersey based on many collectors’ views and even the write up in Mastro's auction indicate anything but medium or heavy use. This jersey does exhibit light game use, especially when you consider the position Jim Brown played.
Now based on all the above information, how can my Rollie Fingers (relief pitcher) jersey score a MEARS A-8 subtracted -2 for “light game use” yet Jim Brown, Hall of Fame running back in a full-contact sport get an A-10 when it clearly exhibits light game use?? Dave you have to be kidding me!!!
Could it be because Dave Bushing owns the Jim Brown jersey that he rubber stamps the A-10 on “his” jersey or “Troy’s” jersey” or that Dave Bushing has more to gain financially from an A-10 than an A-8?
This is why collectors are upset with the MEARS grading system and the conflicts of interest that members of MEARS have displayed in the past. You cannot give an A-10 to a football jersey with little game use and then turn around and subtract -2 point for a relief pitcher’s jersey that exhibits the same use as his fellow teammate who played in 158 games in the same year. There is no way you can have it both ways Dave.
I can further illustrate to you that MEARS has miss-evaluated both the 1974 Rollie Fingers jersey and the Jim Brown Cleveland Browns jersey.
Again I am one of your biggest supporters and I am one of your biggest critics.
Mark Weimerskirch