Jeff Bagwell Jersey on eBay

[frikativ54]

Dear Game Used Experts,

Please help me ascertain if the following Jeff Bagwell 2004 "Game-Used" Jersey is legit: http://cgi.ebay.com/Jeff-Bagwell-2004-Houston-Astros-game-used-worn-jersey_W0QQitemZ270228775642QQihZ017QQcategoryZ605 97QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem. Thanks for any help you can provide.

-frik

[loumud]

Dear Game Used Experts,

Please help me ascertain if the following Jeff Bagwell 2004 "Game-Used" Jersey is legit: http://cgi.ebay.com/Jeff-Bagwell-2004-Houston-Astros-game-used-worn-jersey_W0QQitemZ270228775642QQihZ017QQcategoryZ605 97QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem. Thanks for any help you can provide.

-frik

Hey Frik,

I have a 2003 Bagwell pinstriped gamer (with the Space Shuttle Columbia patch) that I bought from Chris Boyd at Houston Sports Investments. It is also a size 52, and the tagging looks the same as this one. It's hard to say without looking at the jersey closer in person. But, from my discussions with Chris, I do know that something else you might want to ask the seller about is whether there is single-thread stitching on the patches (which you can easily see on the inside of the jersey) on the front and back and sleeve of the jersey, with the exception of the large Atros patch on the front of the jersey. The velcro sewn in between the buttons on the chest is also a good indicator, though this can also be easily sewn onto a non-authentic jersey.

In general, though, there seems to be no shortage of collectors on this forum who don't think very much (to say the least) of Lou Sampson or Grey Flannel authentication, so I would proceed with caution on this one. I would probably ask the seller directly what exact game use characteristics the jersey displays, as well as if he could provide a scan of the LOAs so you can see what they say. Some individual (more definitive) digital photos showing the game used evidence would be good too. It's easy to get away with selling possible game-issued jerseys as game used with a bogus LOA these days. Chris Boyd would probably be the best person to contact about it. I hope this helps - somewhat!

Louis

[bagbig]

I have a contact here in Denver who has a great source with the Astros. I have bought several game used bats and jerseys from him. I know Chris Boyd has bought alot of items from him as well. If you are looking for Berkman, Bagwell, or Biggio items you might want to talk with him first. I know he has a great collection and is always selling items. Email me at lane_l@hotmail.com and I will get you his contact info. The email is lane_l The underscore did not show up.

[frikativ54]

Hey Frik,

I have a 2003 Bagwell pinstriped gamer (with the Space Shuttle Columbia patch) that I bought from Chris Boyd at Houston Sports Investments. It is also a size 52, and the tagging looks the same as this one. It's hard to say without looking at the jersey closer in person. But, from my discussions with Chris, I do know that something else you might want to ask the seller about is whether there is single-thread stitching on the patches (which you can easily see on the inside of the jersey) on the front and back and sleeve of the jersey, with the exception of the large Atros patch on the front of the jersey. The velcro sewn in between the buttons on the chest is also a good indicator, though this can also be easily sewn onto a non-authentic jersey.

In general, though, there seems to be no shortage of collectors on this forum who don't think very much (to say the least) of Lou Sampson or Grey Flannel authentication, so I would proceed with caution on this one. I would probably ask the seller directly what exact game use characteristics the jersey displays, as well as if he could provide a scan of the LOAs so you can see what they say. Some individual (more definitive) digital photos showing the game used evidence would be good too. It's easy to get away with selling possible game-issued jerseys as game used with a bogus LOA these days. Chris Boyd would probably be the best person to contact about it. I hope this helps - somewhat!

Louis

Can you email me at lazukor@gmail.com; I would like to discuss some Astros stuff with you.

Thanks,

Frik

[eGameUsed]

Frik,

Again, it is very difficult to make a determination on these more recent jerseys (modern day knits) unless I handle them in person. There are some key identifiers I have been able to determine over the years for authentic and team issued/made jerseys. Some of these identifiers have changed over the years, making it even easier to determine the authenticity. As Lou suggested, the best I can recommend via photos is to request a picture of the inside stitching on patches and front lettering.

Jerseys after mid-2002 should have a full stitched (not a patch) front team or city name. Unfortunately, I don't want to publically share a lot of the common identifiers as it will help me determine fraudulent jerseys.

In fact, after I revealed my 2004 Clemens jersey with tag missing, guess how many Clemens jerseys popped up without front tagging. I don't want that to happen again.

However, if any forum member needs assistance on Astros jerseys from 1962 to current, I will be happy to help as much as I can. Nothing will replace me handling it personally though.

Thanks,

[frikativ54]

But, from my discussions with Chris, I do know that something else you might want to ask the seller about is whether there is single-thread stitching on the patches (which you can easily see on the inside of the jersey) on the front and back and sleeve of the jersey, with the exception of the large Atros patch on the front of the jersey. The velcro sewn in between the buttons on the chest is also a good indicator, though this can also be easily sewn onto a non-authentic jersey.

I have got a Bagwell authentic un-used jersey, and the stitching/velcro matches up to just what you are describing. In this case, you can tell that the jersey's authentic, but nothing about its game-use. So - I guess how does that help you any, unless you are trying to determine if your jersey's Korean after-market crap?

[loumud]

I have got a Bagwell authentic un-used jersey, and the stitching/velcro matches up to just what you are describing. In this case, you can tell that the jersey's authentic, but nothing about its game-use. So - I guess how does that help you any, unless you are trying to determine if your jersey's Korean after-market crap?

Frik,

It helps in the sense that the jersey checks out in several areas that would point to it being authentic. But, again, it's difficult to ascertain whether or not it is truly game used based upon the photos provided in the auction without seeing more substantial photos showing the specific game use, or seeing it in person like Chris Boyd stated.

In general, unless you actually witness the player taking the jersey off his back after the game, I guess you can't really say 100% whether or not it is truly authentic. But, there are viable avenues available that can help you make a more educated decision on whether or not the piece really warrants what you're willing to pay for it.

One suggestion I have, from my experience in the past, is that if the jersey is truly authentic beyond a reasonable doubt in the seller's mind and they really want to get what they think it's worth to them, they will be very cooperative in answering questions you have and providing additional information that would help you make an educated decision as to whether or not the jersey is authentic. I would be very weary of a seller who hides behind the LOA(s) and does not respond to specific queries about the item, or is hesitant to provide additional photos of the item. At that point you are basically taking a gamble, which is fine if you have a lot of disposable income to spend on questionable items for your collection.

Anyway, that would be my best advice to you. Contact the seller directly and try to get more photos and information about the item as well as the source from which the item originated (besides obviously the player). If you pay via Paypal, then you may have recourse against the seller up to $1000 in the event that the item does not check out, regardless of whatever their stated refund policy is in the auction. If you pay by check or MO, then you may be out of luck if the item is bogus!