PDA

View Full Version : Mastro Fiasco!!!



Moustache Gang
11-30-2007, 04:34 PM
Forum Members-

I spoke to Chris the other day in reference to my ordeal with a large auction house. We agreed that I should tell the story an not use names at that point as maybe something could be worked out. I gave the auction house until 4 pm today to come up with some type of resolution, but they have failed to respond back. For this reason, I feel it is necessary to include the name of the auction house and those involved.

I recently placed a winning bid for a group of non-game used jersey with Mastro Auctions. I paid for the bid almost immediately in full. The entire lot was won for about $225.00 plus hammer fee. Much less than I have paid for lots in the past, but non the less, I was the winning bidder.

I did not receive the lot in the mail for about two – three weeks when I received an email from a representative of the firm stating that there was a small issue with the lot. The email stated it would be cleared up within a week.

Less than a week later, I called the representative and asked him to give me an update. He advised the jerseys were not stolen and that it is a “he said – he said” issue on ownership, but that the matter would be cleared up and they stated that the one jersey out of the group that I wanted would be sent to me. The representative stated, I have everything under control.” I stated fine, that I do not even want the other five jerseys in the lot and they can keep those. All I really wanted was the one jersey. They said great that will help expediate the whole process.

Days later I emailed back the firm and asked why I had not received the jersey. The representative had stated it, “is now out of his control” and that he would clear it up next week.

The next week they advised me that the jerseys were indeed stolen. I asked them if a police report was filled out and they advised “no”. I asked if an insurance claim was made and they advised “no”. I asked them what evidence they had and they advised “none”.

Here are the emails from that point forward…Their typos were left as is….

Mark,

The story is that the jerseys went up for auction from our consignor through us. Apparently the owner of Stall and Dean saw them online and contacted us. The jerseys were apparently removed from the factory without the owner's knowledge a few years ago. When he found them online, he contacted us to explain the situation. Apparently the consignor once worked at Stall & Dean, and there we are scepticle about how he came across the group.

We thought that this might be a resolution that pleases all parties, except the consignor. The owner has stated that he wants that particular jersey back, but is willing to produce another one for you. If this doesn't work for you, then we will refund your money and that's that. We do not care to be in the middle of a silly legal battle and it isn't worth it over a $220 lot.

You choose:
Money back
Or Money back and a jersey.

This is not good for any of us, but we are trying to resolve it as best we can.
Please let me know.
Thanks,
Chris Snyder

Chris,

I am trying to be very reasonable here. As a former Chief of Police I always try to resolve situations in a fair and honest manner. I guy calling up and stating he once owned these jerseys does not constitute ownership of said jerseys. I asked you if he filed a police report and you stated "no". What evidence has this guy provided that clearly illustrates he is the owner of the jerseys??

So far here is what we have...

1. Mastro posted this lot on their website and in the catalog.

2. I followed the rules posted on the Mastro website and in the catalog.

3. I paid for the jerseys in full within the required time.

4. I received an email from you stating that there are some issues with the lot and will get back to me in a week.

5. I called you up for further explanation and you stated "it is under control and that it is he said - she said...no a he said - he said" and have it under control. You also stated that you would have it resolved within one week. I even gave you options to expediate the process.

6. Then you email me a couple of days later and state that "it is out of your control"

Now your stating that I cannot have the jersey that I legally bid on and legally won in your auction??? And now you state take your money back or money and a fabricated jersey that is not what I legally bid on and rightfully won.

I absolutely do not approve of your "take it or leave it approach". I do not care if this is a $200.00 auction or a $20K auction. This is not the professional tact a world-class auction house should take.

I have read over the auction rules and it clearly states that Mastro and/or the consigner have custody of the lot until the lot is paid for in full. The lot was paid for in full and I have not been shown any evidence that this fourth party has rightful ownership to the Oakland A's jersey.

I need to see evidence that the jersey does in fact belong to this fourth party.

Please email me this information. I have no problem talking to or emailing this party. I am just trying to rectify this mess and will not put up with a take it or leave it attitude.

I am sure you want nothing more than to handle this is the utmost professional manner.

Sincerely,

Mark Weimerskirch

Mark,

We have confimed this is stolen property through evidence provided by the former owner. The consignor agrees. On that basis we are cancelling the sale.

Regards,
Doug


Doug,

I have been seriously misled by Chris. He advised that this lot was not stolen, he was in total control of the situation, that he would take care of it within a week and I would get the A's jersey. I even offered not to take the other five jerseys in the lot and still pay full price in order to expediate the transaction. Then days later, Chris advised me he is not in control of the situation and now you are telling me that the jerseys are indeed stolen.

I understand people can change their minds and admit to an act after thinking about the ramifications or just that it was an improper act to begin with in the first place. I clearly understand that the jerseys may have been stolen.

Doug, based on my experience in dealing with Chris it is very difficult for me to now believe the jerseys were indeed stolen. I have seen no evidence to indicate they were stolen and I just cannot take your word for it based on my Chris' conduct in this matter.

I will consider this a closed case if:

1. I receive signed letters from the owner of the company and the cosigner attesting to the fact that the jerseys were taken illegally. Both parties should include an address on the letter to verify they are who they state they are.

2. That I am paid in full immediately.

Again, I have been more than professional in dealing with this fiasco. My confidence in your auction house has eroded considerably, but I am sure you will take the correct actions to rectify this incident.

I await your response.

Mark


Doug,

I have not heard back from you. I have discussed this case with my attorneys and they have reviewed my statements, mastro emails and mastro auctions specific rules and clearly believe I have been damaged.

I am only asking for solid proof that the jerseys were indeed stolen. Your avoidance on this issue only bolsters my belief that something is afoul here and I will take the steps I need to remedy and resolve this issue.

I need to hear back from you by this Friday at 4 pm est or I will aggressively pursue action to acquire the jersey that I rightfully won on your auction.

We really do not need to go down this route as it only costs money on both sides and we are talking about a $220.00 auction, but you have left me with little option.

Again, I await your response.

Mark

I am busy with the beginning of the auction. I will respond tomorrow.Doug

Great!!

We will await your response.

Mark


Mark,

I am sorry of Chris seemed a bit evasive. This was a matter of the individual who claimed the material was stolen, provided pictures of the material when it was in his possession but could never provide a police report as it would have been done after the fact.

When Chris finally pushed the consignor he admitted he used to be under the employment of Stahl and Dean and was willing to relinquish all ownership and claims to the material.

I hope this answers your questions.

Sincerely,
Doug Allen

Doug,

This whole episode and the way you and Chris handled it is absurd.

What you describe in your email below (above now) was all completed after the fact that I won the jersey and paid for it in full.

According to your explicit rules:

#13 All sales are final.

#15 Title to any lot remains with the consignor or Mastro Auction and shall not pass to the successful bidder until the lost is actually paid for in full.

The lot was paid for in full. Custody and ownership of the entire lot including the A's jersey now belong to me. You, Chris or Mastro cannot arbitrarily take back ownership of my property and give it to a third party.

There is no evidence that this property was stolen. A 3rd party has photos of the jerseys and the cosigner states he used to work at Stall and Dean does not constitute that the jerseys were indeed stolen. There is no police report and there is no record of them being stolen. Is there a insurance claim based on the theft??

This is absolutely illegal and we have clear grounds for recourse in civil courts.

We are still willing to negotiate, but right now the 3rd party does not have any right to my jerseys.

We await your response by 4 pm this afternoon or we will pursue legal action.

Sincerely,

Mark

End of emails

Forum Members- This is where the story stops. My money has not been returned. Mastro has taken it upon themselves to break their own rules and screw the little guy. All I asked for is evidence that the jerseys were indeed stolen and they refuse to show me any evidence whatsoever. Clearly based on the rules of their auctions, the jerseys should be in my possession, but they chose to break their own rules and become judge, jury and executioner and give them back to a fourth party, when rightfully, according to their posted rules the jerseys belong to me.

I am all about getting things right and if these are indeed "stolen" I have no right to these jerseys whatsoever. They need to go to the proper owner. Mastro's actions clearly illustrates that they are trying to cover up, withold or at the least not be transparent in their auctions process and they have clearly broken their own rules.

All I have asked for is proper evidence to indicate the jerseys were stolen and Mastro believes they do not have to provide any evidence and they can arbitrarily give them to a fourth party when the jerseys legally belong to me.

Both my attorneys and I fully disagree with the actions of Mastro Auctions.

Mark Weimerskirch
Maumee, Ohio

ironmanfan
11-30-2007, 05:18 PM
Sounds somewhat similar going back to the Louisville Slugger contracts listed in the 1999 Sotheby's Barry Halper Auction. Appears to be a disputed issue of "employee theft" as opposed to someone breaking into their factory & stealing inventory. They probably didn't even realize these things were missing until their attention was brought to the auction.

I can't believe you'd get a lawyer involved over such a situation (particularly considering the amount). Perhaps Mastro could have handled their communications better, but it seems as if their hands are tied and I would just take my refund and move on with my life.

bigtruck260
11-30-2007, 06:13 PM
Attorney's - Good God.

Mark, like IMF said, just take the $225 and run with it. Use your experience as an example when someone asks about Mastro. It looks like Mastro had something happen that was beyond their control and a rep. was not fully informed. Sounds like he stopped contact with you so that he could go higher up and have someone else handle your claim who was better equipped to do so.

I am actaully impressed that Mastro stopped the sale after they were informed of something...it seems that many auction houses ignore outside inteference when it comes to their catalog items.

Not saying you should not be upset that you lost out on a jersey (lot) - but put yourself in the shoes of the company that was stolen from. If you saw an item of yours that was stolen listed in an auction , you would probably contact the auction house and demand to have the item removed...and (i'm guessing here) you most likely would not let them sell it to the highest bidder.

Litigation seems like a little much. Sorry in advance if you feel differently.

Dave

otismalibu
11-30-2007, 07:15 PM
Are you sure it simply didn't meet the imaginary reserve?

Let us know if the items show up again.

:)

brianborsch
11-30-2007, 07:43 PM
It sounds fishy to me. Why can't they provide proof? I am all for someone sticking it to these guys as they NEVER allow people to stick it to them. They need to learn they can't ALWAYS have their cake and eat it too.

Crap like this gets me upset.

Moustache Gang
12-01-2007, 01:58 PM
Forum Members-

I wanted to give you and update on this case.

As of this morning, Doug Allen of Mastro refuses to turn over any evidence whatsoever that the jerseys were indeed stolen from Stall & Dean. He has turned everything over to an attorney in Chicago.

I learned over the years to never speculate or assume, but in my 14 year law enforcement executive career, executive at General Motors and now owner of a successful consulting firm I have never, ever seen an individual or firm turn a $225.00 case over to their attorneys!!! One hour of a Chicago attorney's time is has to be near this number or more.

We are in the process of contacting Stall & Dean administrators to see if we can ascertain if the jerseys were indeed stolen.

I cannot of the life of me understand why Doug and Mastro would spend hundreds if not thousands of dollars in attorney's fees for a $225.00 lot.

My attorneys and I clearly believe, base on Mastro's own rules, we have rightful ownership of the jerseys until Mastro can prove otherwise. They simply refuse to show us any evidence.

I can rest assure forum members, that we will leave no stone unturned until we find the truth of this case.

Thanks to all those who have provided great feedback. I appreciate it and this is why the forum is such a wonderful place to learn so much about our hobby.

Sincerely,

Mark Weimerskirch
Maumee, Ohio

3arod13
12-01-2007, 02:11 PM
Sounds like a simple case of "we didn't get enough for the lot, so we'll just say the items were stolen, return the $225, and then sell them for more elsewhere."

Just my thoughts, but I've seen it happen way too often.

David
12-01-2007, 03:45 PM
I few years ago I won a lot at Mastro where there was an ownership or consignor's dispute with Mastro. I don't know the details of the issue and won't speculate-- though know that the complainer was a Hall of Famer. Mastro's President called me at home the day or so after the auction and appologized for the situation but said his his hands were tied. I wanted the lot, but there wasn't much I could do and let it go.

David
12-01-2007, 03:54 PM
In defense of Mastro:

In another situation, at Mastro I won an All-Star diamond ring that was awarded to a Hall of Fame baseball player. Soon after I won it, I was contacted by the player's lawyer who not so politely said the ring was stolen from the player and I had to return it. I contacted Mastro about the situation and Bill Mastro himself looked into it. It turns out that the player skipped the All-Star game and, thus, was never given the ring. Instead, MLB let the elderly sportswriter who handed out the rights to keep it for his collection. So Mastro proved that the ring could not have been stolen from the player, as he never owned it!

David
12-01-2007, 04:02 PM
Correction to last post: The eldery sportswriter physically handed out the "rings" to the players at the All-Star Game, not the "rights."

The one thing that bothered me about the episode was that the lawyer didn't say the ring "might have been stolen" or "we think it was stolen." He said absolutely and matter-of-factly it "was" stolen from the player-- when it turns out it not only wasn't stolen from the player, but it was impossible for it to have been.

jdr3
12-01-2007, 10:41 PM
"I cannot of the life of me understand why Doug and Mastro would spend hundreds if not thousands of dollars in attorney's fees for a $225.00 lot."

Because they are under investigation for other things such as shill bidding and what role they had in the Jordan UNC Warm Up shirt. This just adds one more letigious headache for them.

skyliner59
12-01-2007, 11:19 PM
$225 may seem like a nominal amount of money. But multiply it many times over and it can surely add up quickly. I remember I won a lot of Birdie Tebbetts Phillies baseballs. Paid for in full, but was shortchanged several of the older balls in the collection which were replaced with more recent ones. Response from Mastro was sorry "Charlie". Never did business with them again. This is just one example from one sale. I have had others from other houses as well.
To all forum readers, many of these so called auction houses are simply dealers from the card shows of the early "80's" who decided it is easier to steal online than face to face. Why do you think so many sports memorabilia auction houses are around now!!!!!
My bet is that almost anyone who has had several dealings with these auction houses, has some sort of horry story.
Mark, don't spend too much on legal fees on these deadbeats. Just look at it like you just paid tuition for a little education.

cohibasmoker
12-02-2007, 12:01 AM
Forum Members-

I wanted to give you and update on this case.

As of this morning, Doug Allen of Mastro refuses to turn over any evidence whatsoever that the jerseys were indeed stolen from Stall & Dean. He has turned everything over to an attorney in Chicago.

I learned over the years to never speculate or assume, but in my 14 year law enforcement executive career, executive at General Motors and now owner of a successful consulting firm I have never, ever seen an individual or firm turn a $225.00 case over to their attorneys!!! One hour of a Chicago attorney's time is has to be near this number or more.

We are in the process of contacting Stall & Dean administrators to see if we can ascertain if the jerseys were indeed stolen.

I cannot of the life of me understand why Doug and Mastro would spend hundreds if not thousands of dollars in attorney's fees for a $225.00 lot.

My attorneys and I clearly believe, base on Mastro's own rules, we have rightful ownership of the jerseys until Mastro can prove otherwise. They simply refuse to show us any evidence.

I can rest assure forum members, that we will leave no stone unturned until we find the truth of this case.

Thanks to all those who have provided great feedback. I appreciate it and this is why the forum is such a wonderful place to learn so much about our hobby.

Sincerely,

Mark Weimerskirch
Maumee, Ohio


Mark, how hard can it be to prove ownership? All Stall and Dean has to do is show that the items were stolen. As you know, that can be done quite easily with either a copy of a police report OR, a copy of a SCIC/NCIC entry sheet followed up and a quick call to the issuing agency to confirm the authenticity and validity of the documents.

Hopefully MastroNet saw either one or both of the above documents before they sent YOUR items to Stall and Dean.

Jim