first chance to get a jersey with the new captains patch

[mfsquirrelmaster]

http://www.nflauction.nfl.com/cgi-bin/ncommerce3/User?id=denNFL&wl=65664914&type=A

[jayt1234]

Again I am pretty new to this hobby, but I cannot believe the prices some people pay for some stuff.

Jay

[mfsquirrelmaster]

Every item on the nfl, mlb, and nba auction websites seem to go very high. Maybe the different charitys have something to do with it. Maybe people have given up all hope in finding legit gamers on other auction websites.

[Jags Fan Dan]

Every item on the nfl, mlb, and nba auction websites seem to go very high. Maybe the different charitys have something to do with it. Maybe people have given up all hope in finding legit gamers on other auction websites.

I, too, could almost justify some of the price increase just due to buyer's comfort in the authenticity, but even the non-game used stuff (autographed footballs and mini helmets) go for way, way more than the same item on ebay would command.

[Jake51]

Hi,

I'm the guy that won these auctions tonight so I thought I would quickly throw my two cents in.

My reasoning for picking up these jerseys [at these prices] is:

Authenticity - I have no doubt these are truly game worn, not only because of the source but I was also able to photo match them as well. I normally shy away from 'modern' jerseys like the plague because of the abundance of fake gamers out there so the only way I would make a purchase of a newer gamer is with iron clad proof that it is real.
Closure - I am a life-long Broncos fan and I only collect Broncos gamers. My primary focus is on 60's and 70's Broncos gamers however there were four modern day players I wanted to add to my collection: Rod Smith, Tom Nalen, John Lynch, Champ Bailey. The only one I had remaining on my list was Champ so I can now officially close out the 'modern day' portion of my collection and devote all of my attention to older players. [I took a flyer on the Cutler in the hope that he lives up to the hype. If he doesn't I'll be posting on the greatest regrets thread that was posted recently!]
Fun - The last reason is just plain enjoyment. I was at this game, cheered so loud that I couldn't talk the next day and have these to add to my memories of the game.Anyway, that's it. Thanks for reading.

Tom

[jayt1234]

Just so you know I was not in anyway criticizing the jersey or the price, I was only amazed at how much some stuff can, and does go for. It is fair to say that the money is well spent for a number of reasons but like you mentioned the 100% certainty of where it came from is worth a lot. Buying that same jersey on Ebay for 1/2 the cost supplied by "a friend of a friend who knows the equipment manager" would be questionable. Also having what could be the first captains Jersey is pretty cool as well.

Jay

[mvandor]

Just so you know I was not in anyway criticizing the jersey or the price, I was only amazed at how much some stuff can, and does go for. It is fair to say that the money is well spent for a number of reasons but like you mentioned the 100% certainty of where it came from is worth a lot. Buying that same jersey on Ebay for 1/2 the cost supplied by "a friend of a friend who knows the equipment manager" would be questionable. Also having what could be the first captains Jersey is pretty cool as well.

Jay
There is no question, NFL Auctions items go off at insane prices, only those collectors that are pretty well off need apply there. You see mostly run of the mill junk like signed authentic jerseys going off at $1,000+ which makes no sense when you can get very solid identical items for $200-300 easily through non-NFL sellers. Complete waste of money just to say "hey I got it from the NFL".

Little different on game worn items of course, where provenance IS important, but man do you pay a premium for it in nearly all cases.

[RKGIBSON]

Jake 51

Those are nice jerseys.

I really do not agree with several of the posters here, as far as them thinking someone has over paid for items in a competive auction like the NFL. If you want them you do what it takes to get them. It appears to me that several others wanted them as well at about the same price. Jake51, me or anyone else does not want to pay anymore than needed to get a item. The market value of that jersey with NFL provenance is $4K today. Besides that, collectors buy items because they want them for their collections, and they are REAL, not because they are a deal. REAL items cost money because other like minded collectors want them too.

Jake51, nice peices.

Roger

[mvandor]

Jake 51

Those are nice jerseys.

I really do not agree with several of the posters here, as far as them thinking someone has over paid for items in a competive auction like the NFL. If you want them you do what it takes to get them. It appears to me that several others wanted them as well at about the same price. Jake51, me or anyone else does not want to pay anymore than needed to get a item. The market value of that jersey with NFL provenance is $4K today. Besides that, collectors buy items because they want them for their collections, and they are REAL, not because they are a deal. REAL items cost money because other like minded collectors want them too.

Jake51, nice peices.

Roger
I think it's safe to say the average collector (not knowing enough to do his own authentication work) is running scared due to the insane amount of fraud perpetrated in the hobby while the feds turn a blind eye. The result is an inflated value on items direct from the NFL or MLB.

Perhaps if the feds threw a few dozen crooks in jail, the market would settle down.

[Jake51]

Jay – No worries, I didn’t take your comments as a personal criticism, I just wanted to share where I was coming from with these jerseys.

Mvandor – Personally, I agree with you that the prices for non game used items seems excessive. That said, it goes back to doing what you need to do to feel good about what you picked up. If going the ebay route or to a questionable auction house leaves a twinge of doubt in your mind that keeps you from enjoying your item, then sometimes the premium is worth it.

Roger – Thanks, I am pretty excited to have them. Also, I couldn’t have said it better myself – I don’t want to pay more then I have to but I also have made a conscious choice not to sit on the sidelines when something comes up that I want to add to my collection. Guess it plays to the addictive nature of this whole hobby...ha!

I also have a question for you, have you purchased from NFL auctions before? This is my first time buying from them and I was just curious as to how fast they ship.

Thanks again for the comments.

Tom

[RKGIBSON]

If there were 10 Champ Bailey jerseys that could be verified as real on Ebay, this jersey certainly would not be worth $4K. I do not know where you get a real Bailey jersey if you want one.

I will use the Dolphins as a example. I am a Zac Thomas fan. I have bought 3 from NFL auctions. The first one was more expensive that the next and the last one less yet. I see them for sale all the time now. The going price seems to be about $600.00 to $700.00. When I bought my first one I paid $1500.00. At the time, I was glad to pay that and still enjoy owning it. If the Broncos put out a Bailey jersey every game or two this year the prices would go down. The more real items that are out there the lower the price. Is buying the first one on the market economically smart, I don't now. It just gets down to wheather you want it. It may be the only one this year.

I bid on this jersey. I placed a bid at what I wanted to have in it, it was not enough today. If Champ was one of my favorite players I would have paid more.

I have gotten, what I beleive, is a great deal on jerseys before. Others think the price I paid is crazy. I see others pay prices that I would not dream of. Just different likes and desires. Not wrong.

Jake51. Please post good picture when you get your jerseys.

Mvandor. Fraud is exactly why I pay more for a item with a history that an be verified. I have said it here before, I would rather have one real jersey than 20 that might be real.

Roger

[RKGIBSON]

Jake51,

I bought a Issac Bruce, from the Panthers game, in the first NFL 911 Auction. I have probably bought 50 jerseys and helmets from them over the years.

To answer your question, they do ship within a couple of days. I have had a few issues with them in the last year and a half. They changed who runs it or something. I have received the wrong item, but eventually got the correct thing. I have seen several mistakes in listing or infomation that was inaccurate when the item arrived.

The jersey will arrive in a evidence bag. Usually when you open it you'll take a step back. I cut the label off the bag and save the shipping tags to prove where it came from. I wash he jersey that I get. Attached are some photos of jersey that I have washed. Very little is lost except the smell. The one on the floor is before and the manniquin is after. The others are after.

This has been discussed a few time, some don't want them washed. I prefer they are not washed before I get them. For the long term preservation they need to be clean of germs and such. I wash them in a way that it leaves most of the stains. I feel it make the jersey no less real.

Roger

[Jake51]

Roger,

That is an amazing collection you have! Thanks for the information on NFL Auctions [hopefully they don’t have any mix ups on this go round!].

Is there a specific setting you use on your washing machine to get rid of the smell but preserve the grass/field stains? Both of the ones I picked up have so very distinct markings – the Bailey has big grass stain on the shoulder and the Cutler has a field mark down the back with a grass stain on the 6 – I want to make sure I don’t wash either of those out but my wife and daughter already are reluctant to come in my den because of the ‘gamer’ smell so I better not add to it!

To your other comments, I’ll post pics as soon as I get the jerseys. To the other reason that I picked them up, there was an element of them being an investment as well [not for me as I don’t sell but maybe my daughter when I’m long gone..] as I believe Champ has a real shot at the HOF and this would be his first home/regular season jersey with the Captain’s C on it – granted the value will dip if the Broncos sell more of his jerseys this year but I can still prove this is the first home one. To the Cutler, like I mentioned, if he has the career I hope he does then I feel it could be a good investment to have this jersey. Again, none of this really matters to me as I collect for the pure enjoyment of it but looking long term I’d want them to at least hold their value should she want to sell them someday.

Thanks again.

Tom

[jayt1234]

I got an Akin Ayodele G/U Uniform fro Game Exclusives and the smell of that jersey was terrible....I lightly hand washed it with normal laundry detergent in the sink, rolled it up twice in two large beach towels then layed it out flat on our front deck to air dry and that helped give it a better fragrance, and I did not lose any of the game used features....But I would be careful because you do not know how much could be lost...Also I got into this hobby in January of last year an I am almost 100% certain that many of those bidding on the autographed "authentic" Jersey's believe that they are "game used" or "game ssued"...I would have thought back then that I was receiveing something from the lockeroom...I would think the auction shoul make note that these are pro shop jersey's that have since been autographed.

Jay

[jayt1234]

You are corect and in good company for collecting just for the enjoyment of it, rather than the investment. I could justify spending any amount of money on something I enjoy knowing that i am probally not ever going to get a return on my investement. There are alot better certainty in a lot of other investments if that was someones objective.

Jay

[808jerseys]

Tom,
I wash my jerseys the way Jay would do his, but also add WHITE VINEGAR. Let soak for 1hour. Smell will be gone.
Good Luck,
REX

[otismalibu]

Again I am pretty new to this hobby, but I cannot believe the prices some people pay for some stuff.

For many of the big ticket purchases, this seems to be a faith based industry.

Fiat money.

How often do you see an auction house offer a big ticket item, with some sort of visual evidence to substantiate the claim? I'm not talking a photo match, but simply a style match. And when contrary visual evidence is presented on this forum, how often is it addressed?

I called GFC once about a jersey that had been questioned on the old GUF site. Mr. Russek simply told me "the jersey is good". This was an offering with atypical lettering and I was looking for a little more proof. Gotta give them some props, because they will at least take a call or reply with an email. I've never once received a reply from AMI.

If something has a letter from a major auction house, someone is going to believe it's the real deal...whether or not it is or not. And if that buyer subsequently has doubts about his/her purchase, they can rest easy knowing there is another rube not doing their homework who will most likely happily purchase the item.

As long as there are people who have confidence in the currency being passed around, it will always have some value.

[RKGIBSON]

I use the handwash setting on my washer. I put it on the smallest load setting with 1 tablespoon of detergent. I also add about 4 table spoons of salt. I was told years ago that this can be used to set colors in new clothes the first time they are washed. Does it do any good, who knows, but I do it. I usually let the jersey soak at some point in the cycle. I always pull it out between the wash and the spin hand rinse it. If it still smells, I run it through the handwash cycle again not using any more soap.

One more thing I always photo all my jerseys, in detail, before they are washed. If there is ever any question that this is the jersey it can be proven. I have only had one that washing it effected it enough to bring it in question. It was caked in mud from a rainy game. Before and after attached.


Roger

[Jake51]

Thanks everyone for all of the good advice. I'll be honest Roger, seeing that last example you posted makes me nervous to wash mine - I understand why they have to be washed, just hate to lose any of the 'use'. The idea of taking pictures of them when they first show up is a good one, I'll do that and post them to the forum.

Thanks again.

Tom

[RKGIBSON]

Tom,

The keep in mind, the Thomas jersey was caked with mud. That is a lot different than yours or any that I posted pictures of. When I opened the bag there must have been a shovel full of dried dirt that had fallen of the jersey. I took the jersey out and used a hose to get the worst off it before it could be put in the washing machine. The Thomas is still stained brown from the mud. Does anyone thing I should not have cleaned it?
I would not buy a muddy jersey like that again unless it was something really significant that I just had to have. I like to see the game use also, enough so the photos of the game let you know that is the jersey.

At the end of the day its your jersey and choice. If you do not want to wash it don't.

Roger

[Jake51]

Roger,

Gotcha, I couldn't tell from the photos that it was still stained. I agree with washing it, with that much mud on it I would imagine you could run the risk of ruining the jersey down the road - just like the germs/sweat/etc that gets on them.

Chances are I'll wash these when I get them and I really appreciate the tips on the best way to do it.

Thanks again.

Tom

[indyred]

What kind of paperwork/LOA do you get from NFL auctions when you win a game used jersey/helmet? Do they have a hologram system similar to mlb.com? Do they say what date the item was used ect...Would love to see what it looks like....

[RKGIBSON]

The current items do have a PSA-DNA sticker on them. I always go look the item up when I am not purchasing the item first hand. I see items all the time on Ebay and in auctions that say game used but when you look them up they say autographed not game used. You can go into the PSA-DNA web site and look up my items below and see how they word them.

Some in the past had WeTrac or Prov instead.

I save everything that lends credibility, shipping labels from the box. Labels on the bags, everything. Attached are the 2006 LT and a 2003 Ricky Williams. Each team is slightly different.

Roger

[indyred]

A few more are now up on NFL.com. A Cutler from a different game, Dolphins Jason Taylor and Kelsey Bills all have captain patches on them.
http://www.nflauction.nfl.com/cgi-bin/ncommerce3/ProductDisplay?prrfnbr=88589687&prmenbr=65664914&aunbr=88936397