Cliff Hagan jersey

[topekabob]

A game worn Cliff Hagan jersey on ebay now.
This would be a pretty amazing jersey if really a gamer. Any thoughts from our basketball experts?


http://cgi.ebay.com/Vintage-60s-St-Louis-Hawks-Cliff-Hagan-Game-Jersey-44_W0QQitemZ150160150716QQihZ005QQcategoryZ50135QQ ssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

[genius]

Obviously legit as someone made an offer he couldn't refuse after you brought attention to it!

[33bird]

Obviously real since somebody bought it??? I don't agree. People buy BAD stuff all the time on ebay and in big name auction houses. I've bought bad stuff before too when I didn't do enough home work on an item. Now I'm anal about it. I doubt the person who bought it had enough time to really study it, unless he was already familiar with it. Just my 2 cents.
Greg

[both-teams-played-hard]

http://img106.mytextgraphics.com/photolava/2007/09/14/hagan1-47tvp1cnd.jpg
http://img104.mytextgraphics.com/photolava/2007/09/14/hagan2-47tvpeq42.jpg
http://img106.mytextgraphics.com/photolava/2007/09/14/hagan4-47tvprx50.jpg
I had time to study the Hagan. Its realer than the real deal Holyfield. Its hard to tell from the Getty watermark, but it seems to be a perfect photomatch. Notice the repair mark to the right of "HAWKS". This jersey is from Paul Silas and is legitimate. I asked the seller to end early when the auction was 2 hours old and he declined. When will it be at auction along with this Getty photo? I do not think posting the auction info on this forum brought attention (although I cringed when I saw the post). You win some..you lose some...but you live dammit...you live.

[genius]

I would bet anyone who saw that auction prior to that post was pretty disappointed! I think it can't be a coincidence that it was pulled shortly after that particular posting, the auction houses have to be combing this forum left and right. Looked to me like it would have been an opportunity for someone to get a great piece without paying an arm and a leg, while keeping it away from the auction houses. There's nothing better than those rare occasions when you can pay good money but not crazy money. Not that I want to see the seller short-changed, I'm sure it would have brought substantial money. Now though it will go to the guy who paid $30K for the Nate Thurmond Cavaliers jersey. I shot the seller a pretty good but not outrageous offer myself after I saw this just in case he hadn't actually completed a deal but to no avail. It will be in a Christmas catalog somewhere though! I think it should be automatic that you don't draw attention unnecessarily to an item unless it's a fake, otherwise you're kissing it goodbye.

[33bird]

That's cool. Now, I never said it wasn't real. I said just because somebody bought it quick doesn't mean it's legit. I wonder what it went for? Cliff Hagan was a solid player for a solid team. He would have been a Celtic but Red traded him to get a higher pick to get Bill Russell.
Greg

[worldchamps]

I emailed the seller when i first saw the jersey asking if they had a price they would sell the jersey for outright, they replied back they do not end auctions early and wanted to go through the process.

So i am really pissed they ended early

[genius]

I don't think it's possible for an item like that to make it through an ebay auction with all of the "outside offers" coming in. Alas, the auction houses and plain old-fashioned trades seem to be the only way to obtain something like that!

[G1X]

For those who might not be old enough to have seen Cliff Hagan play or be completely familiar with his career, he was one of the best of his era. Along with Bob Petit, the St. Louis Hawks were the best team in the NBA West during the latter part of the 1950s and won the NBA crown in 1958. Hagan made the All-Star team many times and is enhrined in the Basketball Hall of Fame.

Mark Hayne
Gridiron Exchange
gixc@verizon.net

Always looking for WFL, Atlanta Falcons, NFL durene, Darren Lewis & Willie McGee game-used items.

[Fred]

I would bet anyone who saw that auction prior to that post was pretty disappointed! I think it can't be a coincidence that it was pulled shortly after that particular posting, the auction houses have to be combing this forum left and right. Looked to me like it would have been an opportunity for someone to get a great piece without paying an arm and a leg, while keeping it away from the auction houses. There's nothing better than those rare occasions when you can pay good money but not crazy money. Not that I want to see the seller short-changed, I'm sure it would have brought substantial money. Now though it will go to the guy who paid $30K for the Nate Thurmond Cavaliers jersey. I shot the seller a pretty good but not outrageous offer myself after I saw this just in case he hadn't actually completed a deal but to no avail. It will be in a Christmas catalog somewhere though! I think it should be automatic that you don't draw attention unnecessarily to an item unless it's a fake, otherwise you're kissing it goodbye.
We won't have to wait until Christmas as American Memorabilia got a hold of the jersey.

[both-teams-played-hard]

We won't have to wait until Christmas as American Memorabilia got a hold of the jersey.
Wouldn't it be safe to assume that AMI or an employee bought this jersey? It's only been a week! Can you say "conflict of interest"? Can you say "dirty rat b***ards"? As for the eBay seller...can you say "complete, utter dumba*s"?
How long before AMI...err, Skanks-R-Us, puts one of their 2-bit street-walkers(literally) in this jersey? So, how long is it going to take a concerned forum user to email this AMI auction link to this sell-out eBay seller? I was naive and hoped a die-hard collector bought this jersey.

[CollectGU]

BTPH,

I know for a fact that they did not buy the jersey and that it was consigned, so that was an unfair statement to make. It is also in fact photo matched to that same Getty image (the repair) you offered except the date on the Getty image I believe is incorrect.

Regards,
Dave

[both-teams-played-hard]

BTPH,

I know for a fact that they did not buy the jersey and that it was consigned, so that was an unfair statement to make. It is also in fact photo matched to that same Getty image (the repair) you offered except the date on the Getty image I believe is incorrect.

Regards,
Dave
You are right. I apologize to AMI, their friends and family. I also apologize to their team of models who seem to be good, upstanding citizens.

Hope this helps,
BTPH

[Eric]

Dave O'Brien

Nice to hear from you once again regarding AMI- Any chance you can contact them about the whole controversy with the improperly described Hank Gathers jersey?

They completely ignored me, and I was hoping you could help out.
Eric

[CollectGU]

Dave O'Brien

Nice to hear from you once again regarding AMI- Any chance you can contact them about the whole controversy with the improperly described Hank Gathers jersey?

They completely ignored me, and I was hoping you could help out.
Eric

Eric,

From what was explained, they were comfortable with the sources information and how itwas acquired. The yotube was incorrect, and they are aware of that. The winning bidder was supplied with the info from the consignor, and the consignor offered to speak directly to the buyer if they were interested.

Regards,
Dave

[sportscentury]

You are right. I apologize to AMI, their friends and family. I also apologize to their team of models who seem to be good, upstanding citizens.

Hope this helps,
BTPH

Classic. In this spirit of apologizing, I'd like to apologize for any harsh words directed toward auction house employees who enjoy wearing and horseplaying with consigned game used items before they are auctioned off, and to the friends and families of such free-spirited and fun-loving employees, as well.

[mvandor]

Would someone please inform me how Dave seems to know so much about AMI's daily inner workings and spends half his time here pimping them? I missed the back story. :confused:

[CollectGU]

I've consigned to them over the years and became friendly with Victor over that time. Aso, I don't know much about their daily inner workings, I simply pick up the telephone and ask a questions. If misinformation is provided on here that I know about - such as "they must have bought the Hagen jersey directly" I will correct it so perception does not become reality. How is that pimping them? Next time you would like to know something about someone, I suggest you simply e-mail them directly.

Dave

[mvandor]

I've consigned to them over the years and became friendly with Victor over that time. Aso, I don't know much about their daily inner workings, I simply pick up the telephone and ask a questions. If misinformation is provided on here that I know about - such as "they must have bought the Hagen jersey directly" I will correct it so perception does not become reality. How is that pimping them? Next time you would like to know something about someone, I suggest you simply e-mail them directly.

Dave
Well, Dave, you must have a ton of free time to call AMI every time you read something here you don't agree with that pertains to them. 53 years of life experience suggests to me there's more to the story than you describe. Not to mention I get the impression you back their plays religiously here in spite of the fact they've been documented how frequently here selling horribly obvious items as game used? Not that this sets them greatly apart from 90% of their competitors these days.

[worldchamps]

I will be more than willing to email the ebay seller how much it goes for on AMI

I emailed them to try to buy it out right and was told that was against their policies.

[worldchamps]

i just sent him an email with the auction link

after i sent him the email, i did think there is a possibilty I guess AMI contacted him and he is the consignor of the jersey?


I guess that could have happen

I will put his response if he even responds.

[CollectGU]

Well, Dave, you must have a ton of free time to call AMI every time you read something here you don't agree with that pertains to them. 53 years of life experience suggests to me there's more to the story than you describe. Not to mention I get the impression you back their plays religiously here in spite of the fact they've been documented how frequently here selling horribly obvious items as game used? Not that this sets them greatly apart from 90% of their competitors these days.

Mvandor,

Roger Gibson know who I am through AMI. He also receives much of the material that you have complimented him on from them. Ask him if there is anything more to me than a consignor and friend since you seem to value his opinion. I guess your 53 years haven't served your gut instinct very well. I don't back their plays, I try and keep perception from becoming reality unfairly. When they f8ck up, they deserve to get slack just as much as any auction house.

[lund6771]

Dave...

In the past you have posted that your consignment juice to AMI is the same as everyone else, which if I believe memory serves me correctly, is somewhere around 17.5%...I think you went as far as to even post a copy of a statement

how does YOUR gut feel to know that your "friends" have on instances charged other people only 10%?

Being such a loyal "friend" to them may not be such a good thing if you are indeed being charged a maximum rate

[CollectGU]

Pete,

Thank you for jumping into this thread and breaking rule #7. You post clearly is looking to agitate. Also, I am not concerned about other consignment rates, as it's none of my business.

Regards,
Dave

[worldchamps]

Back to the jersey

I emailed the ebay seller, I guess he got really screwed. Someone got this for nothing

Here is his responce, and the email I sent


Bill,
The jersey is gone. I admit I made a terriible error in judgement.
However It's not a concern of mine anymore. Please no more emails on
this subject, Thank You!

> I had emailed you about the Hagan jersey. You told me
> you would not end it early...you did.
>
> Well guess what, the guy you sold it to put it in a
> major auction house
>
> http://www.americanmemorabilia.com/Auction_Item.asp?Auction_ID=39282 (http://www.americanmemorabilia.com/Auction_Item.asp?Auction_ID=39282)
>
> I would have given you more, and I can promise you did
> not get enough for it.
>

[genius]

The seller would have received market value if he had let the auction run. Might not have had a huge overpayment on it but he would have been satisfied, wouldn't have had to pay consignment fees, and the jersey would have gone to a serious collector. I think it's in the best interest of all serious collectors for items like this to stay on ebay rather than go to AMI or elsewhere.

I still think the posting on this forum alerted the buyer to the jersey's presence!

[jonincleve]

jersey went for $9077 without any auction fees.

john

[both-teams-played-hard]

I bet the eBay seller sold it for $1,000. Just a guess, don't know for sure. I offered $500 to end early and the seller said he didn't end auctions early. What were other offers from forum members? (Please don't start a ethical question about ending auctions early...there are other threads on this topic that can be re-freshed.) I am still curious as to how this auction ended early, then was photographed, then appeared on AMI's website in 5 days. I will accept the FedEx theory.

[genius]

I think there's still room to make money on this one, if the buyer takes it to Grey Flannel's next HOF auction. Could go for $15K or more.

[worldchamps]

I never made a formal offer, just tried to see what he wanted.....it pisses me off still, bc he was so set on letting it ride through...then all of the sudden it ended

I would have gone well over $1,000...and I agree, if this jersey was in the HOF auction on GFC it goes for over that.

I would almost bet you we see this jersey again.

Oh I would love to know the details....someone on this board is rolling around laughing when they read these posts....whoever got it, good job!

I do wonder if AM actually bought it directly off ebay??? maybe???